[00:00:04] Broadcasting live from atop the Rocky Mountains, the crossroads of the West, you are listening to the Liberty Roundtable Radio Talk Show.
[00:00:18] Tina Peters, Donald Trump, many performers, real estate agents, Google, mosquitoes, AI. Happy to have you along, my fellow Americans. It's Sam Bushman with hard-hitting news the network's reviews to use, and it all starts now.
[00:00:43] Tina Peters, our dear friend from Colorado, well-known election clerk, standing tall for liberty. She's going to be freed today, June 1st, baby. We're kicking it off right, and we're grateful for this news. It's been a long time coming, ladies and gentlemen. Tina Peters was in prison for protecting her county's election data. She never should have been in prison in the first place, folks. This is an interesting, sad tale to tell, I'll tell you what.
[00:01:14] But she went to prison because they say, hey, you know, you made a copy of the database. You shouldn't have done that. You didn't have a right to do that. She was the clerk. It's her job to manage that data. And then when they went to court, the jury was manipulated, gave false information by the judge. Sheriff Richard Mack was there, and he basically reviewed this thing and said, you know what? It's a sham.
[00:01:37] The things that Tina wants to testify about, the things that Tina wants to bring up, the judge just simply said, hey, we're not talking about any of that. How do you offend yourself when the judge won't let you bring up relevant information, such as the accuracy of the data? Of the data. See, the problem is that she said, hey, this data is fraudulent, and I've got the backup. And we can see the backup that I have, and we can see the changed data. We can see the proof. And the judge said, it's not about that.
[00:02:05] It's about you didn't have a right to copy the database kind of a discussion. You're a bad guy. You didn't have any right to do this. And so the whole discussion, the whole purpose, the whole reason Tina Peters stood up, ladies and gentlemen, was literally obliterated by the judge. And the jury doesn't really know better. The jury doesn't realize. And so that's the problem that we see, folks. And so anyway, great news, though.
[00:02:32] Donald Trump put a lot of pressure on the Colorado officials. We the people, through talk radio, podcasters, newsmakers, we all pushed hard in the alternative world. The new media taking center stage once again. You know, Richard Mack and the CSPOA promoting election integrity. True the vote. Many, many others doing a phenomenal job. And we really, in my opinion, did well.
[00:02:58] Now, the Democrat governor of the state of Colorado basically realized how important this was and realized that she had been wronged. He's being attacked by a lot of the Democrats over this. But at least justice prevails in this case. Now, even if you say Tina shouldn't have done what she did, the question becomes, and this is an interesting thing about fully informed juries that we really need to understand. Number one, the case should have been about election fraud, not about Tina Peters.
[00:03:29] Let me say that again. This really should have been about election fraud, not about Tina Peters in the first place. However, they basically wouldn't touch the election fraud discussion. And they only wanted to make it about Tina Peters. Then it should have been, even if it was about Tina Peters, fine. The question becomes, does the sentencing match the crime? And this is really where fully informed juries need to come in. They need to say, this case should have been about election fraud.
[00:03:58] They made it about Tina. That's wrong. We're going to say not guilty because she's not guilty of election fraud. And if we're not going to say it's about election fraud and we're not going to hold those responsible for the election fraud and we're going to switch it to being about Tina Peters, then we shouldn't hold Tina Peters responsible either. So you could say that as a fully informed juror. You could say, you know what, it's about election fraud, but they're making it about Tina Peters.
[00:04:26] Maybe she did something that she shouldn't have done. But did she intentionally violate the law or did she by mistake violate the law? In other words, she thought she was a county clerk. She thought she was responsible for this data. She thought, you know, she freaked out because of election fraud. She genuinely believed that she was preserving the systems which she was sworn to protect and uphold and et cetera. Even if she did something maybe she shouldn't have done. Was it in good faith?
[00:04:55] Did she mean to do something illegal or a criminal activity or this and that? Or did she just do something that turned out to be technically maybe against the law, but yet she meant well? See, that's a big, big, big discussion point. And so you might, as a fully informed jury member, say, wait a minute, I'm here to judge the circumstances, judge the law as much as I am here to judge the, quote, guilt or innocence of a victim. And she might have been guilty of the technicality on this thing, but I don't believe the sentence matches the crime.
[00:05:24] And I don't believe she had any bad intentions. I'm going to vote no. She's not guilty because she's not guilty of what the consequences would give her. And so fully informed juries are really important. The problem is you've got judges that give the jury bogus instructions. Most members of society in America today don't understand fully informed jury realities. And so they get confused on this thing. And there you go, right on down the line. But I'm telling you right now, I'm grateful that Tina Peters is released today.
[00:05:51] And I'm telling you, she should have never been put in prison for protecting county data, county election data in the first place. Even if you say she was wrong, she shouldn't have done it. She's a grandmother. She's never had any prior convictions. She's a good person. There should never have been this kind of sentencing for even if you perceive a crime there. And that's kind of the deal. But when the judge basically says you've got to rule this way or this way or this or that, and then you ask the judge, what about the law?
[00:06:20] And the judge says, I am the law. Yeah. Then you've got a real, real problem. Even Anthony Fauci, Tony Fauci, you know, he said, I am the law. I am the science. I am the – okay, that's bogus, folks. And we know it. And so when judges do that, when leaders say those kind of things, it's that they don't want to take honest responsibility for their actions. So anyway, I'm grateful that the Colorado governor saw the truth.
[00:06:49] I'm grateful we were able to put tremendous pressure on this case. I wish we could dig into election fraud discussions because I think they're relevant and necessary. But at least we got Tina free. And you could say, well, Sam, it's a tiny win in a sea of losses. You know, you're not wrong about that. However, I am going to trust in my God, and I am going to take the wins we get, and I am going to look at it as a very big positive. At least she's going to be home.
[00:07:17] And at least she didn't die in prison. And hopefully she can get her health back, and hopefully she can be back in the speaker's circuit and tell her story. And hopefully we can have truth to power on this. And hopefully, you know, more information will come out, you know, our prayers are for that. Also, headline says, performers walk away. Trump takes center stage for America's 250 kickoff.
[00:07:43] This is an interesting story because Donald Trump tried to put together a 250 celebration in America. And it was a great American state fair is what they were calling it. I think it's a cool thing. And so we invited a bunch of performers to perform, and they basically all backed out and turned them down. It's a disgrace on America, in my opinion.
[00:08:04] Because, look, I don't care if the president is Barack Obama, Donald Trump, George Bush, Bill Clinton, Joe Biden, whoever. Whether you like the president or not, whether you agree with the president or not, whether you politically are aligned with the president or not. In my opinion, when it comes to, like, Olympics or sports or events like this, in my mind, you should support America.
[00:08:32] Even if you say, I'm not here to support the president, but I'm here to support America. I think backing out on these artists' side is a big, big, big mistake. Because it's a chance to set aside differences. It's a chance to be American and to be above division, above partisan politics, above those things that seem to be ever so pervasive in our society. That's why I built the Clarion Call for Civility website.
[00:09:01] And why I'm writing a book about this topic is because it's so critical to understand. Trump now to open Great State American Fair after multiple artists withdraw. After several music acts withdrew from the Great American State Fair over concerns about the event's, quote, political ties,
[00:09:22] President Donald Trump is now scheduled to personally kick off the celebration with an opening ceremony. And he's considering replacing portions of the concert lineup with a major, quote, America is back rally instead. Now, I don't really disagree with him doing this. But I would say that what Trump should do is find other political acts who would be friendly.
[00:09:53] Okay, you could have Ted Nugent go. You could have Kid Rock go. You could have, what's his name? Rich? Shoot. His name's escaping me. Oh, John Rich. Go. Too bad Charlie Daniels passed away. He could have gone. I mean, I understand. I don't blame Trump for doing what he's doing. But at the same time, I just want to throw a bug in Trump's ear in case somebody's listening.
[00:10:18] Organizers confirmed that Trump will headline the June 24th opening of the America 250 festivities in Washington on the National Mall. I would, if it were me, I would ignore this political flashpoint. And I would find artists who would perform. And I would say, you know what? Or gain your loss. If you don't want to celebrate America, you go ahead and back out.
[00:10:46] It'll be a stain on your life forever. We stand together as a country regardless of our political differences. I'm Sam Bushman. Hang on, everybody. Dad, can you make him stop? Honey, he needs to practice. He's been at it an hour. Well, just trying to be patient. Dad, it sounds like a cat calling for help or something. Worse, a basement full of cats. Yeah. You know, hon, it is a little hard on the ears. Not you, too.
[00:11:15] Well, maybe we could all play a game. Andrew, do you want to play a board game? How about we watch a video? Hide and seek? Oh, I don't know. I give up. Maybe we could all just sneak out of the house. Honey, he's nine years old. We can't leave him home alone. And we can make him practice with a sock. Well, I guess we'll have to get some ice cream. Did I hear someone say ice cream? Family. Isn't it about time? Oh, I see the practice hasn't hurt your ears.
[00:11:45] Well, I'm a serious musician. Funny that you never seem to get better on that thing. Works every time. From the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Hey, where did all these cats come from? Meow. Are you watching what's happening in our country and asking, what can I do? Join the John Birch Society in Salt Lake City June 6th for a powerful one-day conference. The day includes a host of respected speakers, two meals, and meaningful connections. You'll gain clarity on the issues
[00:12:14] and walk away with practical steps you can take to your community. Reserve your seat today at jbs.org forward slash slc26. That's jbs.org forward slash slc26. All right. Happy to have you along, my fellow Americans. Back with you live. Lowell Nelson, Campaign for Liberty.org is with me. And I'm talking about two quick stories.
[00:12:44] Lowell Tina Peters gets released today. What a blessing that is. And I was talking about the importance of fully informed juries and how important it really is. You know, she should have never been in prison. And the problem is we have judges that dictate terms that are dishonest and wrong instead of, you know, interpreting the law and giving them the latitude to be fully informed jurors. What the judge does oftentimes is make them feel like they have to rule or adjudicate in certain ways. And the judge kind of believes he is the law rather than, you know, obeying the law. And I said she shouldn't have been in prison
[00:13:13] for a bunch of reasons. One, even if you believe she shouldn't have gathered that data, you got to go back and say she in her heart believed that it was a responsibility to preserve and protect that data. So even if you say, well, she did technically violate something or whatever, you could say, you know what, she was doing her best to really be honorable in her position, and therefore we're going to give her a pass. You could also say, hey, you know what, this should be about the elections and election fraud. And since they're not willing to talk about that, they're making it about Tina Peters.
[00:13:41] We realize that the sentence doesn't match the crime and therefore not guilty. But see, you know, fully informed jurors are far and few between, and we haven't really been afforded those opportunities. But those are the things that should have happened. She should have never gone to prison, and we bless her and are grateful for her, and we hope she gets, you know, well from being in prison. She's been kind of sick and not doing that well. Hopefully she gets better, gets on the campaign trail, tells the tale of truth everywhere she goes. And this is just a tragedy that should have never happened. Any comments on that, Will?
[00:14:10] Well, yeah, first thing that comes to my mind is the treatise by Lysander Spooner entitled Trial by Jury. It's a small treatise. You can read it in like an hour, and it explains pretty much everything what you just said, Sam, in great detail, giving historical context for trial by jury, why we have trial by jury. I mean, he called it the Palladium of Liberty,
[00:14:35] meaning a bulwark, you know, for liberty against the evils of monarchy and the evils of tyranny. And that's what a petite jury is for. It's what a grand jury talks about, both grand juries and petite juries, and the importance of the fact that juries should decide the law before they decide the facts. But just like you said, judges today,
[00:15:03] they tell a jury that they have to accept the law as dictated to them by the judge himself instead of judging the justness of the law against which the accused is being tried. So I totally agree with you, Sam, and we need citizens to understand their power as members of the citizenry who are called to serve on juries. A person who's called to serve on a jury
[00:15:33] has the full right to say not guilty if he or she believes that the law is unjust. And, you know... And or in this case, if the sentence doesn't even match the crime, even if you technically get convinced that there was a crime that she did do something she shouldn't have done, ignorant to the law is no excuse at the same time, you could say, but I don't believe that the sentence matches the crime, though. You've got a person who's never committed a crime in their life. They're a grandmother. They're older. They were a county clerk in the service of their country,
[00:16:01] and they maybe made a mistake and did something wrong. I'm going to vote not guilty here because I don't believe the sentence, what they're proposing, matches the crime at all. You know, you can do stuff like that as a fully informed juror, and that's why I spend so much time on this because it's really important to understand full and informed juries are critical. Oh, absolutely. Right, right. And let me just mention that. Treat us again, Sam. Lysander Spooner is his name, L-Y-S-A-N-D-E-R. Spooner wrote Trial by Jury. It's one of the...
[00:16:31] It was kind of life-changing for me, Sam. I tell you to fully understand, fully informed juries, what they really are and what we ought to be having. I recommend every listener, in the sound of my voice, Sam, get that. If you haven't read it, get it, read it. I mean, you can find it on the Internet. It's free. It's public domain. You can find copies of it on the Internet if you want to read it there, or you can buy a little pamphlet form of the book. It'll only take maybe an hour to read, and it's so helpful, so informative,
[00:17:00] and it's essential. It's an essential piece of every patriot's arsenal of understanding, of knowledge, Sam. In my humble opinion, it's akin to the Federalist and the Anti-Federalist papers, Lowell. It's that valuable. Yeah, absolutely right. I mean, I think of Frédéric Bastier's treatise called The Law. That's got to be up there in the top five books. That's important. Trial by Jury is in my top five, too, Sam.
[00:17:29] I mean, it is that important to understand and to have. Amen to that, Lowell. There's so much to cover, so little time, by the way. The next headline that I have is Donald Trump to take center stage. Performers walk away, and so Trump's now going to open the great American great state fair as artists withdraw. So basically, he put together this great American state fair. He wanted to celebrate America's 250.
[00:17:58] He invited a bunch of performers to perform, and basically a bunch of these people just backed out and said, nah, Trump's too political. I'm not doing it, and so they bailed, and I was highlighting in my mind to me this is such a tragedy because whether you agree with Trump or not, whether you're a Trump always guy, a Trump never guy, or whatever, whether you agree with Trump, whether you don't, this is a chance, kind of like sports, kind of like the Olympics, to really rise above all those divisions and rise above opinions and say, look,
[00:18:26] we're celebrating the greatest country on the face of the earth. We're celebrating America, and I think it's a real opportunities missed thing that they didn't do this, and so I'm saying shame on these artists, not because they disagree with Trump. They have every right to disagree or whatever else, but because when you do that, you're saying America is Donald. America is not Donald. Donald's a flash in the pan, just like every other president that's come before him and will come after him, just like every one of our lives are.
[00:18:56] I'm not saying our lives aren't important, but I'm saying in the scheme of things, look, America matters. It's 250 years. Donald Trump hasn't even been alive for half that, right? Maybe a third at best, not even quite a third yet, so I'm just saying why are we, you know, tying that to Trump and making this political and in this political divide society we find ourselves in, we're just so divided we're not going to even perform for America. I like the idea of the performer that says, hey,
[00:19:25] I'm here for the greatest country on the face of the earth. I'm here because America is a blessed place to be. You know what? I might not even agree with Trump. That's not important. What is important is I'm willing to celebrate America with everybody else and try to unite the country. And anyway, all I'm saying is this is a sad missed opportunity by these performers. I'm not here to attack anybody, but I am here to point to civility, point to America's above all this, Lowell. Well, not only is it an opportunity
[00:19:54] missed for the performers, but it's an opportunity missed by people who would have heard those performers and would have been inspired by them. Right? I mean, that's what great music does. It inspires. It lifts. It encourages. It gives hope. It helps people understand how we came to become a great country. And I will say this, Sam. You know, yesterday in our church services,
[00:20:23] we talked about the Declaration of Independence. We talked about the U.S. Constitution, about how they protected and declared moral agency as being one of the highest and holiest, most sacred rights that we have, right? This opportunity that we have to choose between right and wrong, good and evil. And I was impressed that, you know, America is, I guess it was de Tocqueville who said, America is great
[00:20:52] because she is good. And when she ceases to be good, she will cease to be great. Well, we've arrived there, Sam. You know, even though America is wonderful, she has ceased to be good in many, many respects. And because she has ceased to be good, she has also ceased to be great. And it's no longer that city, you know, set on a hill, a light, you know, a city upon a hill that all nations
[00:21:21] can take examples from. Now, there's still the embodiment of the principles of righteousness. Yeah, they're still in the Declaration. They're still in the Constitution. And the fact that we ignore, our public servants ignore the Constitution now, by and large, doesn't mean that those principles aren't still valid. And I would hope that other countries would try to take the principles of good governance embodied in the Constitution
[00:21:50] and in the Declaration and attempt to govern their people, which is really self-government, allow their people to run on those principles. But nevertheless, I mean, we are facing a crisis because by and large, most public servants, they don't understand and they don't follow the Constitution. we have problems because they don't. Like you say, Sam, the U.S. Constitution is a blueprint for liberty. And the moment we turn away from that,
[00:22:19] then we engender our own problems. We create our own problems for us. And government is way too willing to create these problems and then come riding in on a white steed to solve the problems that they themselves created because they need a reason for existing. And unlike the founding fathers who did not want to spend a lot of time in government, they wanted to get back to their farms and to their ranches and to their families and spend time there,
[00:22:48] not in government. So I don't know, I was just rambling a little bit there, Sam, but it's kind of how I feel about, you know, our current situation. You're making valid points. Just so you know, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints had a discussion church-wide. So when I said, well, let me say this, church-wide in the United States at least, highlighting the importance of the Declaration of Independence and the U.S. Constitution. And they made several points
[00:23:17] that I want to kind of hammer on or focus on because you mentioned it. It's really worth bringing up. We studied the same thing in church for me as well. And they really highlighted some fundamental things. They called the Constitution a heavenly banner. And I think that's really important. Ezra Tav Benson, he was a former prophet for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well. He's now the late prophet, if you will. But he basically wrote a pamphlet called the Constitution a heavenly banner, mirroring that viewpoint
[00:23:47] that the first prophet of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints after the Restoration, Joseph Smith called the Constitution a heavenly banner. And then they pointed to several scriptures in the Bible and other scriptures that members of the Church have basically highlighting some of this stuff. Anyway, thanks for listening. It was a tremendous event. I'm Sam Bushman. Lowell Nelson with me. CampaignforLiberty.org. You'll spread the word about the Constitution and about America is better than partisan politics, would you please?
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