[00:00:04] Broadcasting live from atop the Rocky Mountains, the crossroads of the West, you are listening to the Liberty Roundtable Radio Talk Show. Happy to have you along, my fellow Americans. This is the second of a two-part interview. Go check out the first part, ladies and gentlemen. It's great stuff. Not because of me, because of who we had on with us.
[00:00:28] Sugar Bear McFarlane with us then. Go check that interview out. And now, he is a volunteer leader with Braver Angels. He works with their ambassador program. He was a coach, a football player, a teacher. He grew up, but wasn't so pleasant growing up. He learned to fight. But then he got a buddy, and he learned to love. He learned friendship. He learned accountability.
[00:00:51] He got folks teaching him how to read. His dad was a great, voracious reader, taught him to read and more. And now he's with us. And we're talking about all kinds of interesting tidbits. But we kind of dovetailed this idea. Sheriff Richard Mack with us. He's constitutional sheriff's and peace officers association, CSPOA.org. His incredible new book, The Democrat Murder of America, Demagoguery in the First Degree.
[00:01:17] He's got a co-author, Daniel, on that book as well. CSPOA.org to learn more. Or murderofamerica.com to learn more. But Sheriff Mack was asking Sugar Bear a sports question. Imagine that, Sheriff. Yeah, absolutely, Sam. Because, you know, he and I both love sports. And I played college football and baseball for one year.
[00:01:42] And then my wife came into me. Well, this beautiful blonde, beautiful, beautiful woman just mesmerized me. And I decided that we needed to get married. And I was still going to school, putting my way through college and never got alone. Just worked my way through college. And she really helped. And we're already having babies. And it was a real miracle. But I've always looked at sports. I love sports. I love college sports.
[00:02:10] So do you agree that paying these top athletes in college sports millions of dollars is a good idea? Or, hey, is it just capitalism? And, hey, they earned it. They get it and whatnot. I don't know if there's any immorality to paying them. But was it a good idea? And I'm not sure myself.
[00:02:34] You know, my capitalist views are, you know, if you can get the money, take it. It's not illegal. It's not immoral. But is it hurting college sports? Is it helping? Or what's going on with this, Ron? Well, I'll start off like this. Everything that I have a question mark in my brain about, I go to scripture.
[00:02:57] And I went to 1 Corinthians 10, 23 to 24. And basically it says, I have the right to do anything you say, but not everything is beneficial. And it goes on about, you know, and I looked at that and I said, hmm, here I am, sugar bear many years later. I always wonder, where's my NIL reparations? You would have made a lot of money back then.
[00:03:23] Oh, big time. Hot and juicy, Wendy's. I would have had, I have had nine surgeries. Okay. But I stand on it as a former athlete and I said, yes, I agree with NIL. I agree with the transfer portals. What I don't agree with is how it was set up, the rules. The regulations and the rules are jacked.
[00:03:46] And so they need to pull, reel it in because it's causing college football to not even want to watch anymore because of one. You get attached. See the fans, they get attached. That's my boy. That's my team. You know what I mean? It's an emotional thing for them. And then they leave. Then they go. Yes. And they go to the college you hate the most. Oh, yeah. Big time. You know?
[00:04:14] The other problem with it, too, that I see, ladies and gentlemen, is this. You know, college, what's its purpose? Its purpose is to educate. Its purpose is to prepare people to, you know, take the next steps in their life. I don't have a problem with sports in college, but I guess what I'm saying is if you start to put too much money into it, then you start getting all kinds of behind-the-scenes scandals. Hey, let's get you to our college under this, you know, premise or let's do this or let's do that.
[00:04:42] And pretty soon, the corruption starts to enter. Do you see that, too, Ron? Well, I saw it before NIL and transfer. It's always been there. It's just the villain. But you have money to that, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But the money was always been there. The sports betting has always been there. Yeah. You know, paying athletes to throw a game or whatever. Yeah, that's always been there.
[00:05:07] But I'm talking about even colleges, though, using money to just woo people at different schools and this and that to where it's not even about education anymore. And pretty soon, the sports program – I mean, the coach is probably the most powerful guy in the room. And BYU is one of the best or the worst, depending on – Yes, never mind the dean or anybody else or the president of the – hey, man, the sports guy has more control than anybody else because that's where the bread goes from, baby. I understand. So what do you say, Ron?
[00:05:34] I understand exactly. I acknowledge what both of you are saying. But if we go back old school and we look at – I went through the recruiting process. I was recruited by every Big Ten school, several SECs, and then I ended up at little old Iowa State. You know the reason? Because they only offered me a scholarship. I was one of those guys that says, I don't want to be paid. I don't want to owe someone.
[00:06:03] But the atmosphere was out there. Oh, Sugar Bear, go get in that Cadillac and move it over to Lot A and back. You know you might be able to get that car when you come here. That's been here forever. And we can't have our head in the sand and say it, but it's – but the way it is now is just exploding. Yeah, so it's not money that's the problem. It's the love of money that creates the problem.
[00:06:31] I'm just telling you, the more incentives we toss it in the mix, the worse it can get, ladies and gentlemen. That's kind of my general point. But I want to dovetail this discussion, speaking of sports, into something very interesting. You know, everybody's here for the World Cup and soccer. And so I got a headline that I created. They came for soccer. They discovered America. And what you're seeing is that people are now from all kinds of countries coming to America, and they're like, man, our media lied to us. When I came to America, I thought it was going to suck. I thought it was going to be horrible.
[00:07:00] And when I get here, man, people are holding the door for me. People are nice. Let's all get out. The amount of food and drinks are incredible. The service is awesome. I went to Bucky's, and I've never seen as many gas pumps and bathrooms and great food in my life. I don't know what to do. And they're running around praising America everywhere. It's something, Sugar Bear. Yes. And I put that same analogy to growing up in the inner city of Cincinnati.
[00:07:25] And I was fed all the rhetoric about white people, about police, about this. And I leave that environment, and I go, somebody lied to me. You understand what I'm saying? Yes, sir. You know who the biggest racists are? It's those white, blind people. They're the ones that you've got to look out for them, Sheriff. You know, I'll tell you what. Yeah, I will tell you something. But you have to understand the historical piece of that, though.
[00:07:53] You keep those historical facts because there was some bad things done. Oh, sure. There was. That's right. It was wrong then, and it's wrong now. It should not stop your journey to be a positive person in this world. And getting back to your about the soccer, I got some buddies that have a restaurant down in Georgia. And he says, I love the refugees coming in. I love the immigrants. And like years ago, he could care less.
[00:08:23] And so, you know, it's interesting. But that is something. I've been out of the country before, and a lot of my relatives have never been out of the country. And I see poverty. I see corruption. I see all this and that. And I'm like, why wouldn't somebody want to come to America? You know? It's like I'm so happy to get back to America when I see those things. Amen to that. And, Sheriff, I bring it up because it's so interesting to watch these immigrants.
[00:08:53] I shouldn't say immigrants. These people coming to visit America. And immigrants feel the same thing, by the way. But, I mean, these people are just going, wow, it isn't what I thought it was at all. And they're literally going viral on social everywhere about this topic. Yeah. If you think Americans are crazy about sports, wait till you see the people from all across the world that really love their soccer teams. Yeah. I mean, those people are, they are goober. They're rabid, buddy. They are.
[00:09:22] But I love the spirit. I love the spirit of sports. And I love the spirit of what's going on right now. And I really do believe, especially the Olympics, I think it really does bring the world together. Yes. And I love sportsmanship. I love good sports. The good sports show stories in just my lifetime. And I think you can agree with this, Ron.
[00:09:49] It builds character and it made you and me both who we are. That is true. I didn't know anything about soccer. I'm one of those old school coaches. They used to think soccer was a communist sport. You know, I was like. I don't like soccer. I don't like it. Yeah. But I had. It's boring. All they're doing is running. They get one to nothing or two to one. What? Yes.
[00:10:18] They got to find a way to score more goals so it's more fascinating. Everybody loves the score, right? Right. So isn't that the original football though, Sugar Bear? Am I? Well, a combination of soccer, rugby and all the all together. So, yeah. All right, ladies and gentlemen. Sheriff Mack. It's Ron Sugar Bear McFarlane. We're talking about BraverAngels.org. Their convention is coming up in a couple of days. You can watch it online. I'm going to be there live, ladies and gentlemen, participating in some of the panels.
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[00:11:39] Now, on America's 250th anniversary, you're invited to join fellow citizens in Philadelphia for a historic gathering dedicated to renewing that spirit. 1776 to 2026, a pledge renewed. This is more than a convention. It's a call to courageous citizenship. Join Americans from every background and walk of life as we learn to listen better, engage respectfully, build trust across differences, and strengthen the bonds that hold our nation together.
[00:12:07] Together, we'll explore how ordinary citizens can help build a stronger, freer, and more united America. June 25 through June 28, 2026. Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Register today at braverangels.org. Join the conversation. Renew the pledge. Help shape America's next 250 years. Braverangels. Braverangels.org. Sheriff Mack, standing tall. Still answering freedom's call. A badge of promise.
[00:12:36] A constitutional track history. Won't forget Sheriff Mack. Sugar Bear McFarlane with us, ladies and gentlemen. Braver Angels. He started out as a young man, a football star, and a fighter. He decides to be a braver angel, ladies and gentlemen. He spent a lot of his life. This is kind of interesting.
[00:12:58] I am working on a project called Low Key Legends, ladies and gentlemen, where we highlight just people, incredible people doing incredible things that you never get to hear about. It's like hero stories. The stories that make you go, wow, I didn't know so-and-so who was a famous person for this really was incredible at that or whatever.
[00:13:15] So you got this fighter football star turned religious sugar bear, turned religious leader, a coach, mind you, who has spent time in hospice helping people, listening to people, loving people, just giving support. Tell us the story about how that all culminated in Braver Angels, sir. Well, you know, people that know me in Braver Angels, I have a method to how I speak to people.
[00:13:43] I try to speak to 30 people a day in my 100-foot circle of influence. I call it the 3-1-1. I drip, drip, drip. I just, I hand out business cards, et cetera. I was at the doctor's office one day, you know, for my health. And I noticed an older guy, gentleman with Iowa State uniform on or a hat and everything. And we just started talking about sports, you know, and everything. And then I ended up talking about Braver Angels.
[00:14:12] I said, you ought to come to our meetings. We have the meetings the second Saturday every month in the Ames, Iowa Library. Once you come, boom, boom, boom, boom. So I didn't hear, I didn't see him for a while or everything. I get called to go out to visit a patient in hospice. So before I always go in, I always pray. And I said, Lord, help me remind myself that it's not about me.
[00:14:37] So I walk in and I see the nurse and a counselor sitting on the bed. And this older guy sitting in the chair, it looks like he's about ready to, you know, pass, like immediately. He hears my voice. He jumps up out of his chair. He says, that's Sugar Bear. He was talking to me about Braver Angels. And I almost cried. And I said to me, this guy, he's about ready to die.
[00:15:06] And he's talking about what I said to him about Braver Angels. And I said, I'm going to keep on, keep on having a voice for Braver Angels. And that's my, you know, my hospice. I've been doing it for 15 years or so. And I had back surgery. So I've had to, I had to take a sabbatical on it. But man, that, that story just every time I go out and I speak to people about Braver Angels,
[00:15:33] that resonates in my mind as a courageous citizen. This is what a courageous citizen does. It talks to everyone, trying to bring them together and say, look, buddy, you know, you're not in hospice. If you were in hospice, you wouldn't be thinking about red and blue and purple. You wouldn't be thinking about that. I said, let's sit down and have a root beer without the root. And so, you know. There you go.
[00:16:01] What are some of the biggest misconceptions that you've found that liberals have about conservatives and vice versa, sir? That we hate them. That's the biggest misconception. But that's polarization. They think that we don't, we hate them. They think that, well, especially my Democrat friends, when they talk to Sugar Bear, they find out that he leans to the right. Oh, my goodness. Next thing you know, I'm off the lily pads. In Inverdale, huh? Oh, yeah.
[00:16:31] I am lost child. And I said, no, listen to my biology, not my ideology. I said, you need to understand my story and then where I came from and what I am now. And why? And why? That's the first thing. I said, why don't you ask me, why am I a Republican or why this? And that is how we get started.
[00:17:00] And I tell them, I said, just because I believe in those principles doesn't mean I hate Democrats and vice versa. It's all fear. They either run. They either run. They either silently smile to you or they just won't get in the conversation.
[00:17:21] So we have to go one at a time, three conversations at a time and just talk to people and build that relationship. Because what I've found is relationships is the most important thing. Once you get a relationship, then Sugar Bear can talk about anything with someone, you know, once we have that connection. Because they know my heart. They know where I'm coming from. Sheriff?
[00:17:47] But let me, that brings up a real solid point for me. And what you're saying, I totally agree with. But I have a hard time being congenial and being friendly when it comes to the word abortion. Yeah. I got you. There's so many people. I got you. Especially Democrats. Yeah.
[00:18:10] That believe that that is, they actually call it, the propaganda and the brainwashing, they actually call it a constitutional right. That's the biggest lie there ever was. The Constitution does not do that. And that they think it's okay to have a partial birth abortion. That's something created by the Clintons and Obama. That, oh, yeah, you know, we don't want it. We certainly don't want it to happen very often. But it's okay because it's still the right of the mother to do that.
[00:18:39] So while a baby is being born, they totally justify that murder. Yeah. And so how do you have a reasonable conversation? I'm just going to be the voice of the baby before we turn it over to Ron. I'm going to be the voice of the baby before we turn it over to Ron. Don't take me out. Yeah. Well, I acknowledge everything you say. And I understand it because I feel the same way as well.
[00:19:05] And the way I come about it is I say, first of all, I'm not the CEO. That means I'm not God. But I'm here to model it. And, you know, I try not to lecture them because they do not hear you. Because they think they are right. It's just like me on the football field. I'm not here to win you over.
[00:19:33] I'm here to knock you out and win the game. And that's how most people, when they have opposite views are, that is the way they are. And so what you want to do is you show them, model them, that you do care and you love. And it takes time. It's not like Jell-O pudding, you know, instant grits and stuff like that. It takes time if you've got the patience. But I understand exactly what you're saying. Because that's like making pickles, you know.
[00:20:02] Oh, my goodness. Yeah. Because it's so out there to me. I mean, it's so obvious that that's an immoral sin. Yeah, but so is taking away people's agency, too. And a lot of people want to do that, too. So there you go. I want to finish up the conversation a little bit on two points. One, what do you think George Washington would think of our political environment right now? Well, I'll tell you what.
[00:20:29] I think George Washington, first of all, he would take his teeth out, you know, those wooden teeth. And then he'd say, boy, if you must argue, don't burn down the house you live in, okay? And then he would say, well, he would start talking about one conversation, one relationship at a time. He would be the ultimate braver angel, I think, you know, with his British hairdo, you know.
[00:20:59] I think he would, with the white hairdo and everything. And then I think he would follow up, and then he would try to be, have what we call, what I'm wearing on my shirt, one heartbeat. One invitation at a time. He would probably, you know, I don't know if he would look at Genesis 11, 6, but he would be a team member about it. He wouldn't like it, but I think he would try to heal the divide in a slow type of process.
[00:21:28] He would no doubt provide godly leadership as he did in his day. He'd be the greatest general for solutions that we could find. I believe that. Before we end, I want to kind of find out, what are you going to be doing at the convention, sir? Well, we got a breakout session. The first day, ours is 3.30 to 5 o'clock, and we're trying to demonstrate what is a courageous citizen.
[00:21:53] And I'm on the part about building relationships, and I'm fighting the intellectual pieces from above. Not above as far as God, but, you know, you get the intellectuals, and they want to do all these intellectual words, and I just get out and be old school and just say, you know. It's like what grandma used to say, you know. Boy, you got mouth poop in your dresser drawer, you know.
[00:22:20] It's like, you know, she would say that old school type of stuff. And I said, let's just roll up our sleeves and form a relationship. So that's what I'm doing. And then I'm going to listen to a lot of jazz because I like jazz. I like the beat, the melody. And I like brave angels, how we put it all together. And I'm going to eat a lot of food and talk a lot of stuff and remind people about Sugar Bear. And I'm going to hang out with Sugar Bear because that's what it's all about, ladies and gentlemen.
[00:22:50] I just want to remind everybody that you have two ears and one mouth. I was always told as a kid, learn to use them proportionately, Sam. I think I failed the test, Sheriff. Well, you do very well at all of it, Sam. And I've learned a lot from you over the years. And I'm really glad to meet you, Ron. Yes. Thanks for being with us and thanks for what you do. Do you ever get sit-downs with the NAACP? You know, I've snuck in their meetings before.
[00:23:20] I joined because I was recruiting them for Braver Angels. Until they found out that I was the other side. Let's go. They ought to join, though. That's really what we need to do, though, is realize that, folks, there's a greater cause here, Ron. I should show you my card. I wish I could show you my card. I would love to sit down and discuss everything with them. But I believe that the CSPOA, our organization, has a lot more to do with civil rights than they do today.
[00:23:50] Well, they're about fundraising, man. Well, anyway. Ladies and gentlemen, they came for soccer and they discovered America. You can rediscover America at the Braver Angels Conference. You can look through a greater, broader, wiser, humbler leadership lens. Braverangels.org. Check out their convention. I'm going to be there in a couple of days with Sugar Bear. Sugar Bear and the Good Sheriff together on your radio and TV, ladies and gentlemen. It doesn't get better than that.
[00:24:19] I'm yours truly, Sam Bushman. Thanks for being alongside for the ride. And CSPOA.org. Braverangels.org. And I'm Sam Bushman. I'm everywhere. LibertyRoundtable.com. YouTube. Rumble. X. What do they call that thing? Truth Social. We're everywhere. Spread the word. Share the love. And God save the Republic of the United States of America.