Radio Show Hour 2 – 01/31/2025

[00:00:13] Broadcasting live from atop the Rocky Mountains, the crossroads of the West. You are listening to the Liberty Roundtable Radio Talk Show. Happy to have you along, my fellow Americans. Sam Bushman live on your radio. Hard-hitting news the network refused to use, no doubt, continues now. This is the broadcast for January the 30th in the year of our Lord 2025.

[00:00:38] This is Hour 202, the goal to promote God, family, and country to protect life, liberty, and property. To do so on your radio and the traditions of our founding fathers. Using the supreme law of the land, the constitution of the United States of America as our guide. We reject revolution, unless it's a Jesus revolution. Then we're in because we follow the Prince of Peace. We're also convinced the checks and balances brilliantly put in place by the founding fathers. What are the peaceful restorative solutions we still have at our fingertips?

[00:01:03] All right, we talked about no survivors expected in the Potomac Air crash. It's a tragedy. Our prayers are with the families. But we have on a lady. Her name is Janice Heisel. She's a political reporter. She also reports on the Trump administration. The EpochTimes.com is who she's a reporter with. They wanted her move to Washington, D.C. and cover the White House. She said, no, I'm good.

[00:01:32] I don't blame her. Welcome to the broadcast, Janice. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. So you have a little bit of intel. You've been watching these drones and all that kind of stuff. We'll get to that in a minute. But you've got a little bit to say about this air collision. It's very strange. Trump's going, how come the helicopter didn't maneuver? What's happening? We hear the plane drop the ton, that there was some issues there. It just, I mean, it's a tragedy. Any intel about how this happened or what's really going on here?

[00:02:02] It seems like how could this have happened in one of the most controlled airspaces in the world, right? Absolutely. That is one of the biggest questions that everybody has right now. And that's the big reaction other than, of course, everybody just mourning the loss of life here. It's coming out that there were figure skaters on board this plane. And, you know, it's just really been a brewing issue, though, within aviation for quite some time.

[00:02:28] Prior to covering the Trump campaign, I actually covered a lot of aviation issues. And I wrote a story that got thousands of, you know, thousands and thousands of reactions from people about woke airline policies, the diversity, equity, inclusion, people being hired for pilots jobs and flight attendant jobs, which are actually safety jobs, not just bringing you coffee or tea. You know, these people are actually safety officers on board those planes.

[00:02:55] And there was a lot of concern raised back then in 2022 when I wrote those stories about aviation and about, you know, needing to hire qualified people. I had pilots telling me, and I reported on this at the time, that they couldn't understand what the air traffic controllers were even saying because they didn't pronounce things clearly.

[00:03:15] Maybe they had a thick accent or sounded really urban, but you need to speak extremely clearly when you're trying to communicate with a pilot who is carrying precious lives on that aircraft. Shifting focus from safety to a politically driven agenda is really at the core. Whether it's tied to this or not at this point, we don't really know, though, yet.

[00:03:40] But we do know, though, that, hey, DEI just breeds incompetence, breeds confusion, breeds a political agenda at the expense of safety is really the point, right? Yeah, we don't really know what all the factors were here. And, of course, that's going to take quite some time for some of this to come out. But there are some recordings that are surfacing, the communication between the tower and the aircraft pilots.

[00:04:06] So, just again, there's a lot of concern around this, but we really don't know whether this DEI issue played a factor here. But it is suspected is, I think, the safest thing we can say now. Where do we go from here? Trump put an executive order to this, believe it or not, coincidentally, right? Yes, he did. Actually, on the 21st, which was the day after he took office, his memorandum, actually, instead of an executive order, his memorandum, that may be a little bit of a technicality.

[00:04:36] But he issued in this memorandum requiring the FAA to end the DEI program and engage in what he says is merit-based hiring. So, that is very interesting, especially in light of he made a couple of tweets in regard to his concerns as to whether, you know, lack of merit could have played a role here. Once again, we just don't know. But that is the president's suspicion.

[00:05:02] Do you think that this just brings attention to the issue in a way that will be productive? Well, actually, yes. A lot of people may not remember that this has actually been the safest era for aviation in the United States of America. We have not had a multiple fatality accident in years since 2009 when Colgan Air crashed.

[00:05:31] I believe it was near Buffalo, New York. And because of that crash, there were a bunch of safety measures that were implemented. And it's unfortunate that it often seems to take a disaster or a tragedy of some type for reforms to be made. And I speak with a lot of certainty that we're going to be seeing some changes as a result of this.

[00:05:56] I have already been in contact with some aviation experts who are telling me that the radio communication is one of the biggest problems right now. There needs to be some type of reform there with improvement in communication. So even if DEI itself wasn't any kind of a factor here, the communication, he's very confident, this one expert I spoke to, that it's going to come out that the communication improvements are definitely needed. All right.

[00:06:23] Well, let me point out an article that you wrote a bit ago but directly relates to this. Headline, Biden's FAA pick has no direct aviation experience and faces California probe on this thing, right? Yeah, that was something that I wrote quite a bit ago. So, yes, I do remember that one just a little bit. But there were definite concerns raised at that time for sure.

[00:06:53] Anyway, I bring that up because this isn't an unknown situation is the reason that I'm bringing it up, though. This is known, predicted, talked about, and written about by this Epoch Times reporter right now. Where was the mainstream press, Janice? You know, I think there was some coverage. Some coverage, but perhaps not to the level that it should have been. But anyway, I just find that fascinating, to say the least. All right.

[00:07:22] How does this relate to the drones? You know, drones are flying everywhere. People are saying, oh, my gosh, these drones are crazy. They act like they operate without any. I mean, they've got infinite power, and they're instantly here and there and everywhere. And one second there and one second gone. And everybody else goes, no, you're crazy and delusionary. And somebody else says, no, they're really there. And then the government says, well, yeah, they're really there, but we don't know the origins. And then Biden can't talk, so he doesn't tell you anything. And the administration clams up. And then President Trump gets involved and says, hey, man, I'm going to dig into that thing.

[00:07:52] Then President Trump gets elected, swears in, and comes back and says, hey, no threat. These drones are fine. They were literally sanctioned by the government. They're appropriately there. No enemy. Why weren't we just told that in the first place? What the heck is happening? You know, that was exactly what Trump's new press secretary, Caroline Levitt, said during her very first press briefing. The direction of President Trump's staff did look into what the heck were these drones.

[00:08:21] And it did cause quite a stir among, you know, the general public, especially people who lived in New Jersey and several other, I want to think about a half dozen states where there were a lot of drones being sighted. And here it comes out that they were authorized to be flown by the FAA said, hey, it's okay to fly these for research and other reasons.

[00:08:42] Now, I don't really know what those reasons were, but, you know, it is – it does beg the question, why not just be up front with the American people and quell these – you know, there was almost a hysteria that seemed to develop around these drones. And I can't say I blame people. I interviewed one woman who had the two drones just hovering outside of her house. I think I would be creeped out, and almost anybody would be. No question. It's like, what is happening?

[00:09:12] Yeah. So it's understandable, but it really is sort of a mystery. Is it possibly – and this is just my theory – it could have been there was just such a culture of secrecy that that was just part of the normal business there. That's just my guess.

[00:09:31] But it does seem to make zero sense that if you have an opportunity to nip in the bud other than a vague statement, well, we don't think it's the enemy or we don't see any – that's just – that's, you know, that's not as far as saying, hey, the FAA did authorize these. That's a big difference between, you know, we don't think these are the enemy or we're confident they're not the enemy, however they put it, and then coming out and making it much more clear with just a few more words.

[00:10:00] Well, and when you deny they even exist at first, I mean, people are kind of like, well, if you say it doesn't exist, I'm going to shoot it down and prove to you that it's here. Now, I'm not supporting an idea like that for one second. Don't misunderstand me. But what I'm saying is you almost leave that kind of stuff open to possibility that shouldn't even be on the table if you just said, listen, they're there. They're justifiably there. We can't get into the details for classified reasons, but we want you to know.

[00:10:27] Otherwise, you leave open this crazy stuff. Go ahead and skip the break and Janice respond. Yeah. I got to tell you, it just was a very strange situation that they didn't just come out with that very simple information. All right. Do you believe the drones are a problem? Because you wrote an article that says, hey, concerns rise right after Chinese drone makers remove security features. I mean, this timing is just weird. It definitely is concerning.

[00:10:57] And I did speak to drone experts. And, in fact, I'm going to be touring a drone manufacturing facility and learning how these things are made. So I'm really excited to peel back the curtain and look at that. But I've got to tell you that, yes, these are of concern. But it's like any other technology. You can use it for a good purpose or a not so good or even scary purpose.

[00:11:19] And so it's evolving to try to figure out how do we minimize the harm and maximize the good of the drones. Well, it turns out that Americans are still in the dark about these drones, even with what we've been told now. And I appreciate Caroline Leavitt coming out. I think she's a breath of fresh air, at least being open and honest to the best of her ability. But at the same time, I think the Americans still remain in the dark over this kind of stuff, right?

[00:11:49] Because it seems like, again, there's just not been a lot of information released on this. And people like me are definitely trying to look into it more for sure. All right. Trump has had a ton of executive orders. I mean, it's just through the roof more than any other president. I'm not a fan of executive orders because I kind of believe that, hey, Congress is supposed to make the laws. And so I'm not a big executive order guy.

[00:12:15] But to some degree, it is revolutionary in what he's been able to accomplish, even first day. And then now over 300 executive orders signed. Your thoughts on this? Well, there are, of course, anything that Trump or any other president does. You're going to have people who like what they do and people who don't like it. It seems, though, that there's a lot more of a quick reaction to come out against Trump than what it seems to me over the years. That's been the case because he acts strongly.

[00:12:44] It evokes a strong reaction on the other side. And so in this particular case, it's almost impossible to unpack what all these orders are doing.

[00:12:55] But based on my perception, and I think this is what I've talked to ordinary Americans about, some of the things that people care about the most were the things that came out during the campaign that Trump hit the hardest, including the immigration, which has actually been the illegal immigration has been a concern of his since he very first ran for president, starting his campaign in 2015 for the first time. And, of course, we've had three presidential campaigns of Trump since that time.

[00:13:24] And that particular one, the immigration, is something that a large percent of Americans, all the surveys are showing that you're suspect of maybe this poll or that poll. But when they consistently are showing across the board that people are supportive of this, you tend to believe it a lot more. And just based on what I hear on the streets and all of us hear these things in our daily lives, Americans resent that immigrants are being illegal immigrants.

[00:13:53] They are being given benefits that they, Americans who are here legally as citizens, you know, don't receive the benefits, the money, the free housing, food, whatever. Sure. So that is one of the biggest, I think, changes. And as I recall, Trump has issued at least nine actions related to immigration.

[00:14:13] And one of the most recent, I believe, was yesterday when he was announcing the expansion of Guantanamo Bay Detention Center to accommodate possibly thousands of criminal illegal aliens. So that is something that, once again, people are criticizing it. They're saying it's even possible to hold as many people there. It was designed just for, I think, a few hundred.

[00:14:39] But it's definitely in the works and things are shaking up. All right. Well, speaking of that, Donald Trump and one of his leadership, whatever, and I don't know if it's executive order or whatever. But Trump rolls back deportation protections for thousands of Venezuelans. Right. They say none of them were criminals.

[00:15:07] But, see, the problem with that is it depends on how you define criminal. Because, see, Tom Holman would say if you're in America illegally, you're a criminal because you've created a criminal act by being in the country illegally. Drudge, Drudge Report basically saying, hey, Trump rolls this back, but none of them were criminals. Well, see, that's up for debate depending on your reference point, too. But this shows Donald Trump is serious on multiple fronts with regards to deportation efforts, right? It doesn't seem like that there is a lot of debate about that particular point.

[00:15:35] He is definitely making some moves there. All right. So here's the next thing. 30,000 illegals to be sent to Guantanamo Bay. Trump says, hey, you know what? We can't even trust governments. What will happen is they'll be released, then brought back right into America to commit crime. We're going to make sure the worst of the worst head to Guantanamo Bay. What do you say to that one? Well, it seems like something that the American people have been calling for by and large,

[00:16:04] that, you know, people don't like the idea that people are illegally in this country, some of them with very long criminal records, and they've just been allowed to kind of roam throughout America. And people don't feel safe. And we've seen a number of crimes where people have been killed, raped, you know, very horrible crimes against American citizens. And people do seem to be fed up by it, and they do want some decisive action taken.

[00:16:32] You know, there are people against this that are raising humanitarian concerns, all these other concerns. But by and large, it seems that most of the American people, based on the surveys and the people I've spoken to, are supportive of stronger, much stronger action to curb illegal immigration itself, and also detain and deport those who are criminals particularly.

[00:16:59] Well, and when you look at the signing for the Lake and Riley Act or whatever, and then he basically put an executive order there that basically says, hey, the drug cartels are literally considered terrorist organizations now. And as a result, that's why Guantanamo Bay, it's beyond just a bad guy wanting to steal beer. We're talking about terrorist kind of details here, tied in with drug cartels, sex and women and children trafficking cartels.

[00:17:27] These people are armed to the teeth, militarily speaking. Yeah, there's a lot of concern for the safety of the Border Patrol and our other, you know, ICE officers and people like that who are trying to enforce the laws and trying to round up some of these. They've done, you know, what, several thousand already round up. So, you know, people rounded up. Yeah, they've already deported about 5,000 as far as I understand. Yeah, it's been several thousand since Trump took office.

[00:17:56] And once again, this is all happening at a breakneck pace. I've seen that word and I can't disagree with it. It's definitely keeping all of us in the news business. And I think a lot of American people on their toes, a lot of people, I think, who didn't used to be engaged in politics and news are, I think, much more interested. Also, because there's a lot more free flow of free speech, it seems, out there on a lot of these social platforms that used to restrict speech.

[00:18:26] So there are definite big changes happening in America across the board right now. Yeah, Trump just won $25 million from Meta. They don't admit wrongdoing, but they paid out $25 million to shut down the lawsuit when they shut down his accounts. So you're right, the tide is changing. As far as I understand, President Trump also said we want to have 1,875 illegals gone a day. Yeah, it seems to me there is sort of a goal around that.

[00:18:54] And Tom Homan, whenever I've seen him interviewed, that is a man who is definitely projects an air of he's serious about the job that President Trump is asking of him. You know, there's not a lot of pussyfoot around there. The man just comes right out and says the action that he's taking. And I remember specifically there was a reporter asking, oh, my goodness, can we expect this every day?

[00:19:22] And he just went in terms of the number of arrests and deportations. And he said, yep. Well, I hope it gets even a greater number than that. And I support 100 percent the ridding of the country of hardened criminals for sure. And I believe there's a justice side to that. The American people want it. The president's promised it. Tom Homan doubling down to do that. I'm the CEO of the Constitutional Sheriff's and Peace Officers Association with former Sheriff Richard Mack, who beat Bill Clinton at the Supreme Court over the Brady Bill.

[00:19:50] We have backed Tom Homan in this effort as well. So, you know, hey, this is being taken seriously by lots of people and justifiably so. At the same time, Janice, I would say this, though. There is a mercy side to this, too. If you're here illegally, you have committed a crime. We get it. At the same time, you're not necessarily the same as the hardened criminals at all. And there needs to be room for it and expand the discussion related to that as well.

[00:20:18] I get the feeling that that is on the horizon, but they're very focused on getting rid of what they say would be the, quote, unquote, worst of the worst. And there may be some people that kind of get swept up in these raids, you know, if they're, you know, just fit that category. But they're hanging out with with bad hombres, so to speak. I hate to use that term because it was controversial back in the day. You can say that term on this program. You want to know why? Why? Because this is America. America, you have the freedom of speech.

[00:20:48] You can say whatever you want to. Well, I'll just help but I just speak Spanish. It's not a couple of people to say that kind of stuff. Bad hombres are everywhere, and they've got to stop. So it's WeBM because I do speak some Spanish as well. But, yeah, it was, you know, if these people get swept up with that, you know, but I do think that, of course, right now they are coming right out and say they are trying to scoop up the worst of the worst.

[00:21:09] We're seeing truly, you know, hardened criminals, killers, you know, violent criminals, people like that, drug traffickers, child traffickers, all of that. All right. We're about out of time this segment. Can you stay a little longer, Janice? Absolutely. Do you got a flyer or can you stay? I can stay. All right. Because to me, this illegal alien issue is huge.

[00:21:33] It's probably the biggest issue right now where Trump, you know, in every other area when we get pushback, it's hard for Trump to carry forward his agenda. He froze a bunch of money and a judge overturned it. Then it got rescinded. He, you know, we go on with illegal immigration, though, there seems to be no way to stop the president and Tom Homan from carrying this out. I mean, California literally had a legislative session where they promised $50 million to fight Trump on this. They're losing already.

[00:22:02] And so this is one issue where I think Trump is going to be able to deliver. Well, it seems like he's definitely making moves, and so is Tom Homan. There isn't a lot to stop them right now. We'll see how it shakes out. But right now, it's full steam ahead, it looks like. All right. The other side of the coin is J6 prisoners. Many of them already got released. 1,500-plus got pardoned. Some of them got their sentences commuted. I think it was like 14.

[00:22:32] My dear friend Stuart Rhodes is one of the ones that got his sentences commuted. You've talked to a lot of these people, right? Oh, yes. I spoke to five of them, and a colleague spoke to a sixth person. And I'm in the process of trying to distill all of that information and to do some mini profiles of these people. Very interesting background. Very wide range of people. Spoke to a young man in his 20s from here in Ohio where I live.

[00:23:01] And then all the way up to people in their 50s, people who were literally just thinking they were going to a Trump speech and get swept up into this and get accused of assaulting police officers.

[00:23:13] And very interestingly, one of the people I spoke to who was convicted of four counts of assaulting an officer, even the prosecution admitted in a court record that I saw, that while none of his direct actions directly hurt any officer, that by spraying pepper spray in the air, this guy created an overall environment. And he still was convicted of four counts of assault on a police officer.

[00:23:41] The guy acknowledges maybe that was the smartest thing for him to do. But when you're caught up in a mayhem, literally, maybe people do things they ordinarily would not do. And that's what this guy told me. So I thought that was very interesting. All right. Well, stay there. A dear friend of mine didn't commit any crimes at all. He actually asked to go into the Capitol so that he could go to the restroom. They gave him permission. He went in, went to the bathroom, came out and marveled at how beautiful it was and left.

[00:24:11] In his prosecution, they said he committed no crime of any kind, but he was a drop in the flood that day. What the heck does that mean? That's really what he got prosecuted for and convicted and had to go to jail for 10 days. All right, ladies and gentlemen, Janice Hissle with me.

[00:24:33] He's an Epoch Times reporter, epic Times reporter, doing a great job covering the White House, drones, all kinds of topics. We'll get back and talk more about these J6 prisoners. Prisoners will do it in seconds. Exposing corruption. Informing citizens. Pursuing liberty. You're listening to Liberty News Radio. News this hour from townhall.com.

[00:25:03] I'm Rich Thomason. It is thought to be the deadliest U.S. aviation disaster in almost a quarter century. No one is believed to have survived last night's midair collision of an American Airlines regional jet and a military helicopter at Reagan National Airport near Washington, D.C. There were 64 people on the plane, three on the helicopter. Searchers were in the Potomac River all night long. These responders found extremely frigid conditions. They found heavy wind.

[00:25:32] They found ice on the water. And they operated all night in those conditions. D.C. Fire EMS Chief John Donnelly says so far 28 bodies have been recovered. American Airlines CEO Robert Isom says the plane was on a routine approach when disaster struck. At this time, we don't know why the military aircraft came into the path of the PSA aircraft. Two young champion figure skaters, two of their parents, and two highly regarded Russian figure skating coaches are among the dead.

[00:26:01] The airport, meanwhile, is reopening this hour. The White House fine-tuning its order, halting billions in federal grants and loans. On Monday night, the administration announced a federal spending freeze, which caused confusion and concern among lawmakers, nonprofits, and others. Then on Tuesday, a federal judge temporarily blocked the freeze. Now, the White House says the original memo is rescinded, but says the president's executive orders on federal funding remain in full force and effect.

[00:26:31] White House correspondent Craig Clugston. Israel in the process of releasing 110 Palestinian prisoners. This after Hamas earlier freed eight more of the hostages it has been holding. The Senate Judiciary Committee has convened a confirmation hearing for FBI Director nominee Cash Patel. Watching Wall Street, the Dow trading 72 points higher. The NASDAQ is down 97. The S&P off two points. More on these stories at townhall.com. Hey, everybody. Charlie Kirk here.

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[00:30:13] Broadcasting live from atop the Rocky Mountains, the crossroads of the West, you are listening to the Liberty Roundtable Radio Talk Show. Back with you live, ladies and gentlemen, Janice Heisel, EpochTimes.com political reporter, riding shotgun on the broadcast today. We're talking about J6 prisoners.

[00:30:36] Matthew Huddle from Indiana, pardoned by Trump for the January 6th situation, has now been shot and killed, ladies and gentlemen, by a deputy. I guess they arrested him. We don't have enough of the details on that. Hopefully we can get more information. We've interviewed on Liberty Roundtable Live, as many of you listeners know, several J6 prisoners as well. The latest one we had on is a guy by the name of Brian Mock. He's a Minnesota January 6th defendant.

[00:31:06] He's representing himself and his son, actually, AJ, turned him in to the FBI. He's out on the radio with us on Tuesday. And now Janice has been interviewing several of the J6 prisoners as well. How do you contrast your interviews with these prisoners with the mainstream press narrative over the last four years on this? Janice? Well, thank you for raising this issue.

[00:31:31] I did speak, like I said, to five different J6 people who received pardons. Actually, one of them just got a commuted sentence and is hoping to push that for a pardon. And there was a sixth person that one of my colleagues did interview. And consistently, it was kind of like there was a theme that emerged among all of these people.

[00:31:56] I could hardly get them off the phone, the ones I spoke to on the phone, and then the one young man I spoke to in person. They were releasing four years of pent-up frustrations and just kind of so grateful to be able to rebuild their lives.

[00:32:14] But looking back and feeling like that the truth has been suppressed and continues to be suppressed about what really happened on that day, January 6th of 2021, when it's been called an insurrection. It's been called a riot. It's been called a lot of things. And these people were, you know, by and large, in fact, all of them that I spoke to said that they just got caught up in what was happening there.

[00:32:41] And several of them denied that they did, you know, anything as severe as what they were actually convicted of. They were astounded. They felt like they were in kind of a twilight zone situation that, you know, one guy did say he sprayed pepper spray toward the police. But although no police officer directly stated that he or she had been harmed by this, he was still convicted of four counts of assault on a police officer. And he still can't figure out how that happened.

[00:33:11] I don't know how to respond to this because it seems like they promised us the 40,000 hours of videos. We never got them. We did get some stuff through Tucker Carlson that really changed a lot of that narrative in terms of the police firing all kinds of things into the crowd, the way they treated certain people, the way they shot Ashley Babbitt, the way they that whole side of the story, even though we've got little blips of it being told, hasn't completely been told. And then you had this J6 committee really attack and lie and manipulate the truth.

[00:33:40] And now all of those folks have been pardoned. I still think we need people on the stand. I still think we need to release those videos and get a healthy reality check on the whole narrative. What do you think? Well, you know, the Epoch Times, I'm actually really proud to say that before I joined the Epoch Times, was really at the forefront of digging into a lot of this at the time and produced several documentaries about it

[00:34:06] and actually did review thousands and thousands of hours of footage of all of this. And our good friend Josh Phillip over at the Epoch Times led the way on that one, right? Josh Phillip was one of the ones, but a guy named Joseph Hanneman who used to work with us. He actually really devoted his life to trying to find the truth. And you've got to hand it to any journalist who is so dedicated that they will spend hours and hours and hours without sleep

[00:34:35] to try to just dig into the truth. And that is actually what, you know, all of the people I spoke to told me, that they really want more of the truth to come out. They feel like that they were their side of the story was suppressed and continues to be so. And they also were very concerned about, you know, there were reports coming out where a lot of the footage

[00:35:02] or recordings of depositions taken by that January 6th Congressional Committee, those were not kept. Or documents that were kept but were deleted and then password protected. So when they recovered them, these documents, you couldn't see what they said. So there's a lot of investigation that still needs to be done. And maybe some people are, you know, I'm hearing like a vibe from some people that they're tired of this.

[00:35:27] But these people, the January 6th people I talked to, feel very strongly that the truth needs to come out more to avoid other Americans from facing prosecutions that they say appear to be politically motivated as opposed to, you know, really, really truthfully hurting a police officer versus just pepper spraying in their general direction. All right.

[00:35:52] I think that the Epoch Times did one of the best movies on this as well. I mean, they took all their research and took all the footage they could get, you know, opportunity to review, put together a great movie at the Epoch Times on that. I watched that movie and I've got to say we need lead reporters to really drill into this further. It's one thing to say, hey, we don't want it to happen again. I concur. It's another thing to clear these people's names.

[00:36:18] But most importantly, it's really important to expose the government for not only doing this to innocent American citizens in most cases, and then to be able to peddle this propaganda, propagandistic lie over it for four years and literally put a committee in place to spin those tales and then pardon those committee members. Why do those committee members need a pardon in the first place if there's not guilt?

[00:36:44] And if they accept the pardon, from what we understand, they acknowledge guilt. It seems to me that those people need to be on the stand, even if they may not be able to be prosecuted. We can sure tie that to ground and have the truth reported. This has got to be done, Janice. There is certainly a vibe that I've gotten from these January 6th defendants who are now freed, saying that they are willing to talk to Congress.

[00:37:11] They're willing to do whatever is needed to try to really drill down and get to the truth. And one of the other things that surfaced for me, prior to my arrival at the Uppet Times, I actually had worked 27 years in mainstream press, most of it covering law enforcement, cops and courts beat, as we like to call it. And one of the things that struck me, I was not a journalist at the time of the January 6th, 2021 event,

[00:37:36] but I noticed, and then was reiterated to me in interviews, that the police didn't seem to be giving verbal orders. Like, there's supposed to be a continuum of force. They're supposed to start with, hey, do not move further. You're going to be maced. Or, you know, before they escalate to shooting rubber bullets, shooting other types of projectiles, pepper balls, whatever they were using against the crowd.

[00:38:01] And the people I spoke to said that there was not that continuum, including a police officer, retired New York police officer that I spoke to, a lady named Sarah Carpenter, who still lives in New York or has just returned to her home in Queens, New York, and expressed concern about that. Where do we go with this? What can we do, Janice, to help this happen? Because I believe this is one of the most important things we need to do.

[00:38:29] If we're not careful, things like this could happen to you and I. I mean, I wanted to go to the inauguration of Donald Trump this last time, but I didn't dare go. Why would I want to take a chance to put myself in harm's way that things go wrong there, too? We just can't have this. Look, when the people are afraid of the government, we have tyranny. When the government's afraid of the people, we have liberty. We've got to have that narrative be the truth. Well, I think that probably one of the biggest things that we could try to do,

[00:38:57] a lot of people think, oh, it doesn't make any sense for me to contact my lawmaker. And, you know, I think a lot of times we feel like we, as citizens, might send a letter or an email or whatever to a lawmaker, and it goes into a black hole. But I do think, based on having spoken to people in Congress, that they will start to pay attention if they hear from enough people, if there is enough concern. And I do get the sense that that is something they're not willing to just let go,

[00:39:27] that they do want the truth to come out within certain members of Congress, particularly the members of the Oversight Committee, who were really trying to bring out what actually happened that day. We don't know, you know, for example, who may have been put within the crowd, who, you know, could have been just agitating it. Were these people government assets? Were they Antifa? Or were they truly, you know, Trump supporters gone rogue? We don't know. We just don't know yet.

[00:39:57] And a lot of that information just hasn't come out. And that's the biggest thing that I'm hearing is that people want. I know there's been a lot said about this, but the problem is there's been a lot suppressed. Amen to that. Janice Heisel and others at the Epoch Times and, of course, Liberty Roundtable, Liberty News Radio will be keeping an eye on this ball, too, to help further the truth. We just want it all to come out and the truth to be had.

[00:40:23] And we want accountability for criminal activities by anybody that's committed them and anybody who is wrongfully dealt with or, you know, they've made. You've got to have the crimes relate to the sentences, too. I mean, oftentimes, look, Stuart Rhodes got 18 years. Thank heavens that he got his sentence committed. He needs a pardon. But, look, he didn't even go into the Capitol, and he didn't even bring his guns into D.C. at all. I don't see how you – well, they want to get him because he was a leader of the Oath Keepers,

[00:40:50] claiming that, hey, they can just take the whole Oath Keepers organization down over this. But it's all based on this lie that he was somehow violent and a danger to society, and there's no evidence to that. Zero, Janice. Well, there is a fact, too, that Enrique Terrio with the Proud Boys was not even in the state or anywhere near. Right. That's a fact. He was on a state. Right. So when all of this happened – now, of course, the allegation that landed him in prison for over 20 years

[00:41:18] until he got pardoned – actually, I think it pardoned. He got executed. Yes. Correcting myself there. But, you know, he got convicted, even though he wasn't even anywhere near it, just because, you know, they believe that he – his certain words that he stated showed that he was planning some grand plan. But when I spoke to these people who were there and were convicted, they're telling me there was no plan that they were aware of. It literally was – at least on their part, there wasn't a plan.

[00:41:47] They think there could have been a plan from some outside, you know, actors. Yes. Well, and the real question is, was there a plan? And if so, was it government-inspired or government-provoked? Or, you know, we've caught the FBI being provocateurs in many situations as well. And so we've got to really get to the bottom of that thing. I don't know if you know this, but I interviewed Stuart Rhodes the day before January the 6th. Really? And so what they're trying to do now is say Stuart Rhodes is such an evil character and Sam Bushman, because he interviewed Stuart Rhodes and gave him airtime, Sam Bushman should go to jail too.

[00:42:18] Wow. That's where they're really going with this. It's insane. And I'm just like, wait a minute, hold on. I am friends with Stuart Rhodes because I think he's a great guy. I do believe the Oath Keepers has a legitimate organization and a legitimate peaceful, you know, role in the United States and all that kind of stuff. However, I just interviewed him from a reporter point of view, from a news broadcaster point of view. I've been in the news as a broadcaster for 30-plus years, one of the top talkers in the nation and everything else. How dare they try to say just because I interviewed him the day before the event?

[00:42:48] Look, he was going into town. I knew he was. I felt like he would have a good handle on what the environment was like. He briefed us on it all. But now they're trying to say, hey, there was a conspiracy by me and Stuart on this, and I should go to jail too. They're crazy, Janice. Did anything happen to you specifically as a result of this? Well, they just reported me as a threat to the nation, to Congress two years in a row, put it on the congressional record that I'm the nexus of anti-government hate in America. Other than that, no.

[00:43:17] Other than that, no. My goodness, I really did not realize that. Thank you for sharing that. Here's the facts, though. None of it is true. Yeah, I'm sure your listeners are probably aware of some of it. Maybe people tend to forget things, and boy, I bet you didn't forget that. So I've put up $10,000 to the media and to these people who have reported me to Congress, the Southern Poverty Law Center, and others. And I've said, I'll give you $10,000 if you can find a single act of violence that I'm even associated with.

[00:43:48] They can't do it. So far, you've got your $10,000 in your pocket. Yeah, they can't do it. It doesn't exist. I'm not a violent person. I haven't been a violent person. I'm a peaceful guy. I just have an unrelentious desire to tell the truth and to lay it out as it really is, let the chips fall where they may, Janice. Well, you know, it's so – it's absolutely – you just sit there and shake your head and you can't believe some of these things that came out.

[00:44:12] For example, one of the guys I interviewed, he was – the official said that he actually was planning to do something terrible at the Capitol because he had received a survey text. I think a lot of us get those from Ted Cruz saying, I plan to oppose this media – I mean, the certification of the vote. And will you join me? Are you in favor of this? He responded, yes, sir.

[00:44:42] And because of that, that text that he answered, that was presented as evidence that he was planning to block the certification of the vote. Well, and circling back to Donald Trump, he said, peacefully go to the Capitol and let your congressmen and senators understand that you would like them to look into this election integrity issue. He peacefully said that. They've been saying that, hey, Trump whipped up an insurrection forever, too. That on its face.

[00:45:09] I mean, you have no statements of Trumps that are violent in any way related to that, but they keep pushing that narrative, too. I've got to say, it was just surprising to me that a survey text could be used in that manner to show allegedly that this person had plotted to overthrow the government or stop

[00:45:34] the certification of election just because this person was supporting a congressman who had a legitimate avenue for challenging that result. Amen. Janice, I know I've kept you over time already. We're so grateful for your leadership, for your reporting, for the work that you do, for the Epoch Times and the work that they do. Janice Heisel, ladies and gentlemen, doing a phenomenal job. Keep an eye on her work. Thank you so much. Thank you. There she goes.

[00:46:04] Doing a phenomenal job as always. Look, she's got her hands in all kinds of stuff. Aviation issues at the top of the list. Drone issues at the top of the list. The January 6th people at the top of the list. Check out theepochtimes.com to kind of get a handle on a lot of her work. She's doing a phenomenal job reporting there. They asked her to go to Washington, D.C., and she's like, no, thanks. You know what? That's my kind of hero. Amen. We don't need to.

[00:46:29] And I think we can expand the press corps way beyond just the room. The new media is indeed taking center stage, ladies and gentlemen, I'm here to tell you. And Caroline Leavitt doing a phenomenal job. She spoke at the first press briefing, did a phenomenal job. She said, we welcome independent journalists, podcasters, social media influencers, and content creators to apply for credentials. I already applied. I'm waiting for them back, Caroline.

[00:46:59] And Jim Acosta left CNN. It's a meltdown for the mainstream press as they get relegated to yesteryear, to say the least. 22-plus states sued Trump over the spending freeze. That's a shame. We, the people, need to stand against that and say, wait, why do you want to spend us into oblivion? What's wrong with you people? But all I can tell you is we're making so much progress, ladies and gentlemen. Donald Trump officially calls for end to the income tax.

[00:47:29] Boy, do we need that. It's the first POTUS in history to do so. Tom Holman has a bunch of questions for the clowns that are fighting immigration. There's so much. They say Trump issues big, beautiful quota. Two million government employees offered payouts to resign. Unions and attorneys are saying don't take it, but I say they ought to take it because Trump's serious about downsizing.

[00:47:57] Trump says Microsoft is eyeing purchasing TikTok. We pray that doesn't happen. I don't want the government to own TikTok, and I certainly don't want Bill Gates, that clown, to own anything. Much less. Trump on deep seek. Chinese AI is a huge wake-up call. Well, you know what? My response to that deep seek thing is this. I don't know if they're really beating the Americans like they say they are. In fact, I have a belief that they're not. I have a belief that a lot of that is propaganda.

[00:48:28] I think a lot of groups are finding ways to deliver products and services and AI content with less chips and less expensively than ever before. Let me give you a proof in the pudding for that. Every time a new innovation is made in tech, it's a tiny guy that makes it. And then big business or big corporate, big tech, whatever you want to call it, buys that tech. Right?

[00:48:59] Or that tech rises from the tiny guy. Let me give you an example to make the point. Mark Zuckerberg. What, college student in his dorm creates Facebook? Why didn't the big boys? Why didn't Microsoft create that? Why didn't IBM create that? Why didn't Oracle create that? Why didn't Google create that? Why didn't... I mean, I can go on and on and on, right? All right. So what you've really got is scrappy people with no money. I mean, who flew the first planes? A lot of big corporations had a lot of money to try to fly.

[00:49:29] What'd you get, the Wright brothers? With hardly any money, hardly any, you know, fame. They were kind of nobody's, but they were super dedicated. They doubled down, right? And they got it done. So oftentimes you find that the smaller, less funded, scrappy people with a belief in their heart, with a I know in my heart we can do this, this discussion seems to be the ones that really make the difference on this, right? Or the ones that really move the needle on this.

[00:49:59] So no offense, but I think the media is full of propaganda. Don't believe for one second the Chinese have got the Americans, man. They're way ahead. We're falling way behind. Oh boy. No, no, no, no. Just a smaller group with less resources basically beat somebody to the punch, which always happens. I bet you that there's people in America that are going to beat the communist Chinese to the punch or beat a lot of these big corporations to the punch. And then you're going to have one of these big corporations wanting to buy the little guy.

[00:50:27] Think about that when it comes to podcasting, when it comes to big tech in every way. It's always the little guys that innovate. It's always the little scrappy guys that build a better mousetrap, right? This isn't anything new. And that's why America has been so brilliant, if you will, and has been so successful.

[00:50:52] Because the little guy is usually not ratcheted down with regulation and not controlled with perceived notions or these kind of things. We need to make sure that there's less regulation in America. Thank heavens Donald Trump is working on that. Because what we need to do, in my humble opinion, is let the free market work. And when we do, you'll find teeny groups and small build better mousetraps every time.

[00:51:18] And they'll upset the big boys from the Wright Brothers right on through to Mark Zuckerberg right on through to I mean, I can go on and on and on of how many of these. I mean, think about podcasting. It wasn't started by big business. The new media taking center stage, which I'm one of the leaders of. Look, it didn't start with the big boys. They didn't want to just like disrupt their own media. The newspapers and the television clowns and all these people that are big business, big money. They got spanked when we took to the new media because prices are coming down.

[00:51:47] We're delivering things over the Internet that they could not have imagined years ago. Guys like me can produce short videos and long-term, long-form talk shows. And I can do it on a, what, fraction? A penny to their hundreds and thousands of dollars? See, we're changing the world. So don't believe for one second the communist Chinese beat the Americans. And by golly, you know, we got this big. No, no, no. Small scrappy people every time win.

[00:52:17] And you wait. You'll see some stories come out in the next couple of years. Hey, we've been able to do it even cheaper and faster and better than the communist Chinese. And I'll bet you a thousand bucks it's a small guy that gets it done. I bet you it's a small guy that gets it done. That's my opinion. We'll see what happens. But that's my prediction on this topic.

[00:52:39] It just seems like every time there is a new innovation that needs to be made, a small scrappy group seems to be the ones to get it done. And I don't expect that to change anytime soon unless they regulate us out of the business, if you will. Trump officially calls for an end to the income tax. Hey, man, the little guys have been calling that forever. So, Donald Trump, I'm grateful that you're taking a page out of our playbook on that. Let's see if you can help us get to the finish line, shall we? That's all I'm talking about.

[00:53:09] That's what I'm saying to you. Hey, you know what? That's two hours of incredible talk radio, folks. Incredible guests on your radio. Brian Rust with me. Janice Heisel with me. Epoch Times. Great radio. Always available. Spread the word. Let your friends know. Listen to the interviews. Donate liberally if you can. Just put a positive number and add zeros to your donation, would you please? I'm just saying we need your support. We need your help. We are the little scrappy guys. But we can only innovate. We can only do it if we have a little bit of, I mean, we need the widow's mite, if you will.

[00:53:39] And that's how we succeed. So, we would love your donations at lovingliberty.net, libertyroundtable.com. Donate. And we're not for liberal or liberalism, but when it comes to donations, be as liberal as you can, right? It's the only time we accept liberalism. There you have it. Thanks for being alongside for the ride. I'm Sam Bushman. And this is the one and only Liberty Roundtable Live syndicated by the Loving Liberty Radio Network. Spread the word. Share the love. Check out the incredible work they're doing. Lovingliberty.net. You can download their phone app on Android and Apple.

[00:54:08] And, you know, you can listen live and on-demand radio and all kinds of things at your fingertips. Check it out. Lovingliberty.net. We're on your favorite, what, portable device store? All right. Thanks for being alongside. God save the Republic of the United States of America.