Mark Mitchell, pollster for Rasmussen Polling, recently stated that youth he polled on the Right see America as dysfunctional, corrupt, chaotic, crime-ridden, and rigged against them. One respondent said today’s rising generation is “looking for their Franco,” a reference to Francisco Franco, former ruler of Spain.
Lew interviews Taylor Young of Antelope Hill Publishing to learn more about the history of Franco and the movement against communism he led. General Franco crushed a bloody communist takeover attempt which featured the burning of churches and the mass murder of nuns and other faithful Catholics.
Franco restored order and most civil liberties, and made Spain a beacon in the West against the same Satanic forces seeking to destroy America today. He also fulfilled his stated goal to relinquish power rather than perpetuating the rule of his regime. Antelope Hill has thwarted a historical blackout by the Left and republished several books about Franco, his movement, and the Spanish Civil War he prevailed in.
You can find the books about Franco we discussed in this episode here.
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Look around you.
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Wrong rules the land while waiting justice sleeps.
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I saw in the congress
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and crossing the country,
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campaigning with Ron Paul.
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Tyranny
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rising,
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unspeakable
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evil,
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manifesting,
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devils lying about our heritage who want to
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enslave and replace us.
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But we are Americans
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with a manifest destiny
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to bring the new Jerusalem
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of endless
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possibilities.
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But first, this fight
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for freedom.
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Be a part of it. But don't delay
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because this is the hour of decision.
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Hour of decision with Lou Moore starts now.
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Welcome to the one hundred and first episode
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of hour of decision.
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My name is Lou Moore. And today,
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we're gonna talk about Francisco Franco.
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We're gonna talk about
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the youth of America,
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unhappy, the youth particularly on the right, unhappy
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with the world as they see it right
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now, looking for somebody to really establish order,
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somebody they thought Donald Trump was gonna be.
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And people are actually responding to
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pollster Mark Mitchell, a MAGA pollster, a national
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pollster,
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saying that they're looking for their Franco.
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So we wanna find out a little bit
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more about who Franco was, why he's relevant
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to the situation we have today politically, and
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is relevant to the crisis
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of Western civilization
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overall.
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And I could not think of anybody I
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would rather talk to about this topic than
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Taylor Young
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of Antelope Hill Publishing
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because Taylor Young is a younger person on
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the right,
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at least younger than me.
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And,
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he's also
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a representative of a company that has published
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four books
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about the, Spanish civil war, and and they've,
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published another book that has a chapter that
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also relates to it. So, Taylor, welcome to
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hour of
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decision.
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Well, thank you so much for having me
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on here. I'm I'm very glad to be
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back.
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Yeah. So,
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Taylor,
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you know, I I I grew up in
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a conservative
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household,
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and I'm 70 years old. I was a
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precocious young lad, and I can remember,
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quite young, my folks talking about Franco, how
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he was tough on the communist,
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how we need more people like Franco.
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You know, being involved
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on our side as an ally in the
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cold war as it was
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obsessively known, at that point.
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And, so, you know, I had a little
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bit of conversancy with him, and conservatives
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back in the day loved Franco. William f
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Buckley
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was constantly,
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making positive allusions to Franco. A lot of
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right wingers even spent time American right wingers
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spent time over
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in Franco, Spain,
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and,
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and and heralded,
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the wonderfulness
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of it because it was a very, low
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crime, orderly society,
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marshaled by an individual who had decisively
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defeated
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a communist revolution.
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So
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back in that day,
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Franco was
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heralded.
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Since then, in the world of political correctness,
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we find ourselves now. People that are focused
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on that history
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usually give a little different version.
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But why don't you just, jump in now
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and and tell us a little bit about
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Franco and and start right in on some
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of the books,
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wonderful books at Antelope Hill Publishing,
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that people can afford themselves if they wanna
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learn more about this topic.
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Sure.
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So we like you mentioned, we have four
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books that all relate to this time period
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of,
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the Spain during the civil war shortly
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shortly before the civil war and and after
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the civil war.
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And they are
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Spain nineteen twenty three to forty eight,
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which is primarily a historical book that was
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written,
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around that time period by a British journalist.
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So very useful because you you get a
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contemporary
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look
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on the events of the period. I think
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it was written shortly after World War two.
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And then the other three are a mixture
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of historical and philosophical
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works that relate to the,
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which was the
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primary Spanish,
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nationalist,
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party. And, there's, you know, people debate whether
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they're considered fascist or national syndicalist or national
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socialist or
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or whatever it may be. They they really
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thought of themselves as
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largely and well, it's certainly influenced by some
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of those other ideas, but at the same
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time, their own independent movement.
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So we have,
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Jose Antonio Primo de Rivera's
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Anthology of Speeches and Quotes, which is a
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very neat little book. It's one of my
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favorite of these,
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books that we'll be talking about here. And,
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that's it's a very easy read, and it
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it basically,
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gives you a lot of information about their
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nationalist ideology.
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You have kind of a similar book, Speech
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to the Youth of Spain by Ramiro Ledesma
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Ramos,
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which is his,
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ideology,
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of Spanish,
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nationalism and Spanish fascism.
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And then you have Jose Antonio Fascist, which
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we actually just published, and this is actually
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a recent work. It was written,
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just a few years ago, and the the
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author is Spanish, and he put it together
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from a lot of primary sources like,
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periodicals and and news journals that the Falange,
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put out in Spain, and it's it's kind
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of a history
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of the Falange's movement as well as a
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history specifically of Jose Antonio and his thought
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and his leadership of the movement.
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So that's a review of the primary books
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that we have about Spain. There is one
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other book that has some interesting information related
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to this time period, and that is Empire
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Eternal,
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which is a collection of essays that were
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originally published on American Renaissance
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that have to do with the,
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age of imperialism and colonialism.
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And there is one essay there particularly which
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relates to
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the,
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war in Morocco that the Spanish,
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republic and then the Spanish dictatorship,
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fought against,
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the people of of the Moroccan Mountains,
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which is actually
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it happened, shortly not too long before the
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war, and it's it's, directly related to some
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of the political events that led up to
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the Spanish civil war and and,
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thereby also led up to Franco taking power.
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So,
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that's a a a brief review of the
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books that we have on the subject.
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Okay.
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So a lot you've covered a lot of
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ground there already. So people hear the word
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fascist, Taylor,
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and and some of them, might be, running
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for the hills. Some might be running for
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their shotguns,
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but others are going, oh, okay. Tell me
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more. So,
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without getting too far down into the weeds
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on the definitions of fascism and the
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theorizing of Benito Mussolini and then the many
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people who,
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either followed him or or were kind of
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concurrent with him in many countries
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in Europe.
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Would you say would it be fair to
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say
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that in a climate
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after World War one where
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Marxism was running rampant
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all over Europe,
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that the primary organized response
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to that
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were these various,
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movements who wanted to restore order
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in their countries and,
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use the symbol of the fasces, which, one
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of the meanings is the,
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the the people authorized to,
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be in charge
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and order a society
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that that,
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that those types of movements were the primary
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opposition to this Marxism that was exploding all
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over Europe.
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Yes. That that's absolutely the case. And,
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you know, like you mentioned, each
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kind of version of the of this general
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ideological
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branch had its own particularity
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particularities in each country, and and the same
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was certainly the case in Spain. In Spain,
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it was also a very religious movement. It
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was Spain is a Catholic country, so it
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was very pro Catholic,
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especially Jose Antonio was very,
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pro Catholic and and so was Franco as
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well.
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So like you said, it it it was
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it could really be seen fundamentally
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as a ideology meant to restore order. And
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you also have to remember that at this
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time, not only did you have, you know,
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just communism,
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generally speaking, as as kind of a destabilizing
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ideology,
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but in fact, you you had,
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communist
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revolutions
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taking place in countries like Germany and even
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in Spain as well. There was actually during
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the period of the second republic, which,
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was directly preceding the
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outbreak of the war.
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There was actually a attempted communist revolution, like
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a violent revolution in Spain as well. Now
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now when was that, Taylor? You say second
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republic?
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What what what years are we talking about
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there? You talking about before World War one?
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So this is all this is all before
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World War one. So so,
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Franco comes to power.
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Oh, no. Sorry.
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So I thought you meant World War two.
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This is, in the interwar period. Okay. So
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Okay. Yeah.
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Yeah. Actually, if and just so people are
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clear maybe to give a framework, Franco
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came to power essentially,
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pretty much. I mean, the war was still
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going on, but was that '36?
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Am I right about that?
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Yeah. I think it was I think it
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was about then.
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Close enough for government work, I guess, at
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this month. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah. Okay. Anyway,
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go ahead. I didn't mean to interrupt you,
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but I Oh, no problem. So so I
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was just, you know, saying that,
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order very much needed to be to be
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restored, and there was a lot of economic
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issues as well,
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as as many people are aware. And,
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so
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the the fascists,
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would align themselves against both capitalism, which they
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understood as an international
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force that had,
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really crippled their economies and, destroyed their national
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sovereignty
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and also against Marxism and communism, which they
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saw as really promising to just make the
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situation worse.
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And,
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yeah, again, if we're talking about Spain, there's
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also,
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a defense of of the church.
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There's also a defense of individual liberty as
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well, especially in the, Jose Antonio book. He
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talks about the importance of the individual as,
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you know, a member of the national community,
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and, this is, you know, something that that
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they're not trying to,
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they're not trying to to just become the
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new tyrants or something like that.
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So there's a lot of things that went
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into it, but, you could definitely see it
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as, above all, a
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reaction against all the destabilizing
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forces and a desire to restore order and
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restore a sense of national pride and and
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unified national direction.
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Sure. Sure. So,
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so so just a little bit more on
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the framing of this. So there's a ferment
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going on in Spain like there is in
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a lot of the countries in Europe.
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There,
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is,
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violence,
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anarchist violence and whatnot. There's communist,
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rebellions in various sectors of the country. There's
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ethnic strife that's involved here because of the,
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Basques in the North and the cattle
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Catalonians, I guess, they are in the East
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and but the Barcelona
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region. And, having been there a few times,
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I'm telling you, that hasn't really changed very
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much. Yeah. The level of animosity is pretty
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high there in Catalonia,
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about the
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Castillians,
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or or or the the the may I
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don't know what the right term is. The
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the majority
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Spanish
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in in the region, but so you had
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those things going on. And then there was,
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Jose Antonio
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de Rivera,
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his father
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took, I mean, that they had a military
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hunt that took control of the country in
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the twenties,
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if I'm if I'm right about this,
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because there was so much violence, but it
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was not a popular
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regime. But it lasted a few years
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until,
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until the left gain more, strength after that.
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So it's kinda going back and forth between
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the left and the right in the government
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of Spain. Is that your understanding?
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Yeah. So so if you want, I can
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give a little bit of a a longer
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historical review here for how we get up
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to the situation.
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Yeah.
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So,
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you know, you and and this is primarily
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taken, again, from our Empire Eternal book as
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well as the Love Day book and the,
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speech to the youth of Spain,
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which also has a has a very interesting
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historical review that,
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Ramos,
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does or sorry. Actually, you should say Ledesma,
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that's his first last name, so that's the
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one you go by, that he does in
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that book. But,
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in any case so,
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you know, you can start all the way
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back with the Muslim invasion of Spain takes
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place in the early seven hundreds.
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The,
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Christian
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Visigoths
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are pushed up into the North, into the
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Christian kingdoms from which they begin the Reconquista,
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which takes, you know, a little bit about
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about seven hundred years,
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on until the
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unification of Spain,
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in 1492,
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which
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is the then the beginning of the golden
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age of the Spanish empire. And,
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Ledesma identifies
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this golden age as lasting approximately a hundred
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years until 1588,
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at which point the the Spanish empire has
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kind of lost its glory. It's lost its,
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power, and, he says that this isn't really,
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so much a,
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due to internal weakness, but that it was
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defeated,
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by the twin forces of the English empire
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and the Protestant reformation.
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And so this begins a long period of
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political stagnation in Spain where you have,
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basically,
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a a conflict between traditionalist forces and more
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liberal forces,
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and neither are really able to get,
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get the upper hand over the other. The
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traditionalist forces are obviously they're,
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very pro clerical.
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They're kind of pro imperial, pro the monarchy,
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but they're also kind of very reactionary, very
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static. They're not really trying to move things
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forward. The liberal forces, he says, you know,
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they they could have had at least some
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value in trying to be more,
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progressive in kind of a historical sense and,
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you know, move Spain into a new age,
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but they weren't really good at that either.
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They were just kind of,
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against, you know, the the church and against
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the monarchy and,
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even, you know, in in some ways, just
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kind of against Spain itself. So so neither
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of these are very inspiring,
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and you have kind of
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the this as as we come into the,
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twentieth century, you have, this,
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just,
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series of monarch steps down. You know? You
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have the first republic, which doesn't last very
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long.
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The war that I mentioned in Morocco, which
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is called the Rif War, so this is,
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this starts when,
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a the
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Muslims who live in that area of Morocco,
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especially in the in the Rif Mountains, they
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attack Spain's holdings on Morocco, which are primarily
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centered around two cities.
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And,
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the war doesn't go very well for Spain
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at the beginning.
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They, you know, really to to cope with
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this is actually why the dictatorship
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of Jose Antonio's father, Miguel Primo de Rivera,
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is installed. So the king basically allows him
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to become a dictator, and and, that ends
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the first Spanish Republic.
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And so he governs,
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from 1923
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to 1930.
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Like you identified, he isn't really able
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to,
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kind of establish popular support for his regime,
00:17:14
and also ultimately isn't able to really improve
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the economic situation very well. So,
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he doesn't have any support, so so he
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eventually steps down. The king,
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you know, the king removes,
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support from him,
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and he steps down.
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And then very shortly after that,
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you have the deep
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deposition of the king, and you have the
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second Spanish Republic, which is now we're getting
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into the time period that's that's right before
00:17:43
the civil war.
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So you have this long history of of
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stagnation that has,
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resulted in the cultivation of these anti national,
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anti Spanish liberal forces,
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and now you, of course, have communism in
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the mix as well. So you have the
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Soviets.
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You have far left,
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socialists and far left anarchist groups.
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You have,
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some of the,
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you know, traditional,
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breakaway movements in Spain, the the Catalans, specifically,
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the Basques, really, they end up aligning a
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lot more with the traditionalists, with the Catholics,
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and with Franco.
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But the Catalans
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are an ally of the, liberal government,
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and eventually an ally of the left.
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So they the left comes into power.
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They enact a series of very unpopular,
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basically, Marxist policies against landowners, against the church.
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They are defeated electorally by conservatives. The conservatives
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kind of sit on their hands, and,
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the left returns to power,
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in in between these these two things. And
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this is really a pretty short period of
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time. This is, I think, less than a
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decade that we're talking about here. In between
00:18:58
this period, there's that,
00:19:02
Marxist revolution,
00:19:03
that was attempted that that I mentioned.
00:19:06
So then the left returns to power, and
00:19:07
they're kind of out for blood at this
00:19:09
point. And,
00:19:11
they have
00:19:13
a they have a they
00:19:15
narrowly lose the popular vote. They nevertheless have
00:19:19
a slim majority in the parliament,
00:19:21
and they decide this isn't enough, so they
00:19:23
start just,
00:19:25
kicking out,
00:19:26
deputies that they disagree with,
00:19:29
until they they get a much larger majority,
00:19:31
and then they just start persecuting
00:19:33
right wingers and conservatives of all kinds and
00:19:36
reintroducing all the
00:19:37
unpopular policies.
00:19:40
And, really, at that point, it's it,
00:19:43
is a lot of signs that that point
00:19:45
to the fact that this is just headed
00:19:46
straight for,
00:19:48
a open communist revolution
00:19:50
and the establishment
00:19:52
of a Soviet Spain.
00:19:54
And so that is the point at which,
00:19:56
Franco, who was at that time stationed in
00:19:58
Morocco, he,
00:20:00
basically
00:20:01
begins what you could consider a revolution or
00:20:04
a revolt against this government.
00:20:06
And, some of the generals join in, and
00:20:09
they're quickly joined by a lot of ordinary
00:20:11
Spanish people who,
00:20:13
you know, are also very much not fans
00:20:15
of the government. And that's how you get
00:20:17
the start of the civil war, which they
00:20:18
then eventually win. So that's, hopefully, a a
00:20:21
brief historical review. No. Excellent, Taylor. So I
00:20:24
wanna add a couple of a little spice
00:20:26
to this.
00:20:27
So,
00:20:29
the election in 1936
00:20:32
where that brings the left back into power,
00:20:35
they cheated.
00:20:36
It's a rigged election. It, love love a
00:20:40
day. Your book by Arthur Love a Day
00:20:42
talks about this on page
00:20:44
41,
00:20:46
that they that they did not win the
00:20:48
popular vote, but they they won their majority,
00:20:53
despite the destruction
00:20:54
of urns full of voting papers by the
00:20:57
mob and the falsification
00:20:59
of election figures
00:21:00
that took place in many voting centers
00:21:03
across the country.
00:21:05
So a lot of people believed, and including
00:21:08
this historian,
00:21:10
that they rigged that election to get back
00:21:12
in power. And the other point I wanna
00:21:14
make is the communists are increasingly dominating this
00:21:17
left coalition,
00:21:19
and they just can't help themselves. They are
00:21:21
slaughtering nuns
00:21:22
and burning churches
00:21:24
all over Spain. I mean, they're already totally
00:21:27
out of hand even at the point of
00:21:29
this election,
00:21:30
which is giving fuel to the
00:21:33
people in the military and others saying, you
00:21:35
know, we gotta do something about this.
00:21:38
Yeah. And, the Love Day book is really
00:21:40
the best out of these for getting kind
00:21:42
of the details of of,
00:21:45
you know, the the kind of day to
00:21:46
day events and and a lot of the
00:21:48
communist, and the leftist atrocities.
00:21:51
And, you know, when you read it, it
00:21:52
really reminds you, at least it certainly reminds
00:21:54
me of of, like, the BLM protests and,
00:21:59
specifically in the sense that, you know, Love
00:22:01
Day documents how the the government or the,
00:22:03
you know, the police, the government forces would,
00:22:05
in many cases, just stand by and they
00:22:07
would let,
00:22:09
conservatives or they would let,
00:22:11
you know, business owners or or or churches
00:22:14
be attacked, burned, you know,
00:22:17
beaten, killed by these
00:22:19
anarchist and leftist mobs.
00:22:21
And so it was you know, the the
00:22:23
state, insofar as it existed, was was really
00:22:26
just just there to facilitate
00:22:29
the communists doing whatever they wanted and, receiving
00:22:32
weapons and and training militias and and such.
00:22:36
Sure. Sure.
00:22:38
So
00:22:38
one difference that I can see, you know,
00:22:40
you look at the twenties
00:22:43
where,
00:22:45
and they do have so many names, Taylor.
00:22:47
But, Primo de Rivera, the fellow that wrote
00:22:50
the,
00:22:51
or or the the one that that you
00:22:53
have the anthology of his speeches,
00:22:56
His
00:22:57
father,
00:22:59
came in in the twenties, but it was
00:23:00
just basically the military,
00:23:03
with some traditionalist behind them. They didn't really
00:23:06
have any kind of philosophy
00:23:08
or any kind of positive nationalism
00:23:10
behind them.
00:23:11
And, when Franco,
00:23:14
was persuaded to mobilize the military and mobilize
00:23:18
the, traditionalist
00:23:19
in his era, he had these traditionalist
00:23:22
people that go went back generations.
00:23:24
He had the pro military people, but he
00:23:27
had there was this whole movement ferment
00:23:30
of nationalism
00:23:32
that had a much more coherent thought
00:23:35
behind it
00:23:36
at that point. Would you agree with me?
00:23:39
Yes. Absolutely. I mean, that that that was,
00:23:44
again, as I kind of
00:23:46
was trying to say in the historical reviews
00:23:48
that there's a long history of of there
00:23:49
being an issue with that where there wasn't
00:23:51
really any
00:23:53
ideological faction in Spain that was able to
00:23:56
kind of really capture people's hearts and minds.
00:23:58
So so just like you're saying, you know,
00:24:00
that that was the reason ultimately why Jose
00:24:03
Antonio's
00:24:03
father was not able to make his dictatorship
00:24:07
really successful for for any purposes other than
00:24:09
winning winning the rift war,
00:24:13
and, why Franco's
00:24:14
leadership was ultimately more successful because he integrated
00:24:18
the that
00:24:19
had, you know, a ready made,
00:24:21
philosophy that was very forward looking, that was,
00:24:24
very
00:24:26
responsive to the problems of the time and
00:24:28
that had a a vision for Spain, and
00:24:30
he basically took that and and built upon
00:24:33
that as,
00:24:34
the kind of ideological
00:24:36
philosophical
00:24:37
foundation for his government, which, you know, like
00:24:39
we we mentioned is why it was a
00:24:41
lot more successful at,
00:24:43
reforming Spanish society and and at stabilizing things.
00:24:47
Okay. We're gonna stop right there, Taylor, but
00:24:49
we will be back right after the news.
00:24:51
You are listening to Hour of Decision
00:24:54
on Liberty News Radio. Welcome back to Hour
00:24:57
of Decision. My name is Lou Moore. I'm
00:24:59
here with Taylor Young of Antelope Hill Publishing.
00:25:03
We are talking about Francisco Franco. We're talking
00:25:06
about the and we will be in a
00:25:08
minute talking about the malaise, the iles
00:25:12
of youth on the right.
00:25:13
They're looking at people like Nick Fuentes, folks,
00:25:16
and not believing the old okeydoke anymore on
00:25:18
a lot of topics.
00:25:20
They're seeing disorder in our society,
00:25:22
and they wanna do something about it. So,
00:25:24
anyhow
00:25:26
but, Taylor, before we get into that,
00:25:29
let's just finish up here and talk a
00:25:31
little bit more about the generalissimo.
00:25:33
So, we have a rigged election. The communists
00:25:36
are going wild.
00:25:39
He marshals,
00:25:41
he marshals his forces against them, but he
00:25:43
has a little help, doesn't he,
00:25:46
from overseas, I mean?
00:25:48
Yes. Yes. So so he was supported by,
00:25:51
both Mussolini and, Hitler,
00:25:55
supported the nationalists in in tangible ways. I
00:25:59
mean, they sent, weapons and and equipment.
00:26:02
I think that the Germans actually did a
00:26:05
major airlift for them that really,
00:26:08
got them out of a tight spot at
00:26:09
one point. So they were definitely,
00:26:12
probably pretty instrumental
00:26:14
in the
00:26:15
success of the nationalists in the war.
00:26:18
Yeah. And,
00:26:20
and we also I I should backtrack just
00:26:22
a little bit. So
00:26:24
the biggest difference
00:26:26
that I see I mean, before you get
00:26:27
into the foreign,
00:26:29
interventions, and we should say, folks, the Soviets
00:26:33
are all over this thing. For the other
00:26:34
side,
00:26:35
The U the Communist Party USA sent the
00:26:38
Abraham
00:26:39
Lincoln Brigade,
00:26:41
which at one time was kind of celebrated
00:26:43
in on the the mass media and and
00:26:45
corporate media here,
00:26:47
yeah, in America, but they were nothing but
00:26:49
a bunch of communists,
00:26:51
out of, the Jewish neighborhoods primarily in New
00:26:54
York City.
00:26:55
That had gone over to fight
00:26:57
for the so called Republican forces against Franco.
00:27:00
There was all kinds of interventions around the
00:27:03
world from the left
00:27:05
opposing
00:27:05
Franco and opposing the Spanish nationalists, but he
00:27:09
had a little help as well as Taylor
00:27:11
just said. But he also had
00:27:13
within his own ranks,
00:27:15
there was there was this new ideology,
00:27:19
of phalangeism
00:27:20
that that gave them a kind of a
00:27:22
different dimension
00:27:24
and maybe a different strength
00:27:26
than the, right wing traditionalist
00:27:28
and militarists had,
00:27:30
in earlier,
00:27:31
decades there in Spain. Taylor, you wanted to
00:27:33
speak a little bit more to that?
00:27:36
Yeah. Sure. So, we're talking
00:27:38
about the Love Day book here. And,
00:27:41
so, again, he was a British journalist
00:27:43
who wrote about this period, and he's he's
00:27:46
basically he's sympathetic to Franco. He's trying to,
00:27:51
help,
00:27:52
kind of make a a case for for
00:27:54
Franco as a defender ultimately of western values
00:27:57
against communism specifically.
00:28:00
So he actually refers to this as social
00:28:03
justice. He uses that term. He means a
00:28:06
very different thing than what we think about
00:28:08
it today. What he means in context is
00:28:10
basically
00:28:11
a right ordering of society, which was very
00:28:15
necessary in Spain because,
00:28:17
you know, there was a long period of
00:28:19
centuries of economic stagnation that really had just
00:28:22
destroyed the economy.
00:28:24
And then, you know, you had the leftists
00:28:26
in power and you had the communists that
00:28:28
that were just physically destroying whatever they could.
00:28:31
So you you needed to to reinstill order,
00:28:34
and you needed to,
00:28:37
as well just organize the society in a
00:28:39
way that was fair and that made sense.
00:28:41
And this is a big part of
00:28:44
as it is a big part of of
00:28:46
all the,
00:28:47
you know,
00:28:48
broadly speaking fascist movements of the twentieth century.
00:28:51
This idea of a well organized society where
00:28:54
they're you know, we're not trying to eradicate
00:28:56
the different social classes, but we're we're trying
00:28:59
to help them cooperate with each other better.
00:29:02
And, we're trying to to make an economy
00:29:04
that,
00:29:05
you know, is able to work for everyone,
00:29:08
is able to rebuild the,
00:29:12
the agrarian economy of Spain as as well
00:29:14
as as well as other parts of it.
00:29:17
So that was a it's a big it's
00:29:19
a good way to to kind of help
00:29:21
understand,
00:29:23
the Philanis philosophy is is as a a
00:29:25
right and fair ordering of the economy where,
00:29:31
you know, all of Spain is
00:29:34
is made to work towards
00:29:35
a
00:29:37
great a a grander historical
00:29:40
vision and a grander national unity. So it
00:29:43
was also very much, you know, some people
00:29:45
are aware that Spain has a lot of
00:29:47
different regional identities and regional particularities.
00:29:51
And,
00:29:52
under Franco, it was it was very much,
00:29:55
there's an attempt to to keep the country
00:29:56
very unified and keep it from breaking apart.
00:30:01
And, Jose Antonio, in his book, he talks
00:30:03
about this as well, the the need for
00:30:05
a unified
00:30:06
national destiny so that Spain can be a
00:30:09
sovereign country and so that it can,
00:30:12
you know, work for for all of its
00:30:14
people. So,
00:30:15
it's there are different ways to to kinda
00:30:17
go about it, but that that's one angle
00:30:19
that you could take it from.
00:30:21
Sure. So,
00:30:23
so the there's
00:30:24
there's kind of a unique pivot
00:30:27
that Franco makes that that no one else,
00:30:30
in the world made, from the beginning to
00:30:33
the end of World War two.
00:30:34
There were all these anti communist movements that
00:30:36
had some elements of what we're talking about,
00:30:41
but some of those anti communist movements were
00:30:43
our enemies, our being The United States' enemies
00:30:46
in World War two, like National Socialist Germany,
00:30:49
like, fascist Italy.
00:30:51
But Spain,
00:30:53
had this element,
00:30:55
as well as the traditionalist, but they had
00:30:57
this, Falunge's element was very involved
00:31:00
in what they were doing,
00:31:02
and to the point
00:31:04
that Franco
00:31:05
sent, I think it was 50
00:31:08
troops, the blue,
00:31:10
the blue division, I believe it was called,
00:31:12
to the Russian front
00:31:14
on behalf of National Socialist Germany, but that
00:31:17
their sole mission,
00:31:20
was to fight communism. But they were there
00:31:22
for two years. They fought with great distinction
00:31:25
against the communist on the Eastern front.
00:31:28
And,
00:31:29
but then in 1943,
00:31:32
as Franco's looking around and he's seeing, America,
00:31:36
America's now dominant central role,
00:31:39
in the war against Hitler
00:31:41
and probably just seeing the handwriting on the
00:31:44
wall of what would likely happen,
00:31:47
he he then downgraded that mission to just
00:31:50
volunteers,
00:31:51
the Blue Legion.
00:31:54
And,
00:31:54
anyway and then by the end of the
00:31:57
war,
00:31:59
miraculously,
00:31:59
Franco is now a solid
00:32:02
NATO member,
00:32:04
anti communist
00:32:05
warrior and fighter
00:32:07
for us. Any comments on that, Taylor? On
00:32:10
that pivot?
00:32:12
Yeah. So, I mean, I I think you
00:32:14
can you can really see that he was
00:32:16
trying to keep Spain,
00:32:18
independent
00:32:19
and,
00:32:21
you know, to
00:32:22
have a foreign policy that was just practical
00:32:26
for Spain.
00:32:27
Yeah. I guess you could, maybe call it
00:32:29
a Spain first
00:32:31
foreign policy, if you will.
00:32:33
But, definitely also an ideological
00:32:37
anti communist, and, you know,
00:32:39
that's something that people maybe don't always appreciate.
00:32:42
The kind of the the
00:32:45
complexities
00:32:46
of World War two is that, you know,
00:32:48
for a lot of people, it,
00:32:51
it wasn't
00:32:52
they weren't primarily approaching it as a war
00:32:55
of, you know, Germany wants to dominate Europe.
00:32:58
They're they're approaching it as a war against
00:33:00
communism. And a lot of the Spaniards, especially
00:33:02
the ones who would,
00:33:04
went to the Eastern Front, who were in
00:33:06
the blue division,
00:33:08
That's like you're saying, that's how they thought
00:33:10
about it is that this was is really
00:33:13
a holy war against
00:33:16
this, destructive,
00:33:17
atheistic,
00:33:18
anti Christian thing that was communism and, you
00:33:22
know, whoever was was doing the fighting against
00:33:24
communism, they'd at least had had common cause
00:33:26
there.
00:33:28
Sure. And,
00:33:30
yeah, a lot of people don't understand that
00:33:32
over a million
00:33:34
individuals from many countries,
00:33:37
fought,
00:33:38
on the Eastern Front. They didn't, they weren't
00:33:41
all over the the world, and they weren't
00:33:43
necessarily I I don't think in any cases
00:33:45
really fighting
00:33:47
American forces, but there were about a million
00:33:50
fighting on the Eastern Front
00:33:52
because,
00:33:53
their war these people, many of them, are
00:33:56
in Christians and whatnot
00:33:58
and anti communist movements from their countries.
00:34:01
Their war was against the communist.
00:34:03
And, so it wasn't unique
00:34:05
that Spain had sent this, blue
00:34:08
division and then what became the blue legion
00:34:11
over
00:34:12
the fight in Stalingrad
00:34:13
and all the terrible stuff that happened over
00:34:15
there. But,
00:34:17
that that that there were many many involved
00:34:19
in that cause.
00:34:23
Yeah. Absolutely.
00:34:25
So so,
00:34:27
the next thing I just wanna segue too.
00:34:28
So let's talk a little bit about Franco
00:34:30
in the postwar years. He's now NATO all
00:34:33
the way pro America.
00:34:35
He's considered one of our, best allies, although
00:34:38
the left, you you know, the left never
00:34:40
forgives. They never forgave Nixon
00:34:42
for Alger Hiss no matter how much he
00:34:44
sucked up to the establishment.
00:34:46
And, Franco
00:34:48
was never forgiven,
00:34:50
for his role in defeating,
00:34:52
the original,
00:34:54
leftist government
00:34:55
and and all the subsequent events he was
00:34:57
involved with. He was never
00:34:59
forgiven by the left, was never treated well
00:35:02
in the mainstream,
00:35:03
news media, but nonetheless,
00:35:05
he rehabilitated
00:35:07
himself if that's the right term.
00:35:09
I question if that's the right term, but,
00:35:11
as a as a NATO
00:35:13
anti communist warrior fighting with us, and he
00:35:16
became a darling
00:35:18
of the right.
00:35:20
As I mentioned,
00:35:21
William f Buckley and a fellow named Wilmore
00:35:24
Kendall, who was
00:35:26
a very big, conservative intellectual in the nineteen
00:35:29
fifties. He spent time in Spain. It was
00:35:32
a big deal for a lot of these
00:35:34
hard conservatives,
00:35:36
particularly Catholic
00:35:37
conservatives as Buckley was,
00:35:40
to,
00:35:41
go over and spend time in Spain and
00:35:43
meet with Franco.
00:35:45
And, he really was kind of celebrated,
00:35:48
on the right, on the American right, the
00:35:50
patriotic right of America,
00:35:53
at least during that era.
00:35:57
Yeah. I mean, I I think that, there's
00:35:59
a important lesson there and and like you
00:36:01
said that the the left never forgives.
00:36:04
And,
00:36:06
you know, I think that he he did
00:36:08
the he was really a man of the
00:36:10
hour in his time. You know? He he
00:36:12
saved Spain from becoming a Soviet Republic,
00:36:16
and, he did his best to preserve it,
00:36:19
through World War two. And then after World
00:36:21
War two and, you know, ultimately after his
00:36:23
death,
00:36:24
there just
00:36:26
wasn't wasn't a good successor to kind of
00:36:28
carry on his legacy. So just goes to
00:36:31
show that this is that the our enemies
00:36:33
in this battle are, you know, they don't
00:36:36
take any days off, and and we can't
00:36:38
do either. We can't do that either.
00:36:40
Yeah. So that I I just wanna make
00:36:42
one other comment. I,
00:36:45
being at my age, I I remember
00:36:48
friends of mine that went over to Spain.
00:36:49
Some of them were in the military.
00:36:52
We're over in Franco, Spain. And,
00:36:55
you could practically eat off the streets, folks,
00:36:57
and mostly states in Spain. I mean, he
00:37:00
ran a tight ship over there. No crime.
00:37:02
No crime.
00:37:04
Very clean.
00:37:06
No immigrants. I mean, if you've been to
00:37:08
Spain in the last few years, I mean,
00:37:09
the difference in Spain today from Franco, Spain
00:37:13
is
00:37:14
unbelievable.
00:37:15
But,
00:37:17
you know, for for better or for worse,
00:37:19
and and I'm not gonna get into all
00:37:20
his economic policies and all that, but he,
00:37:23
he ran a pretty tight ship over there,
00:37:25
but
00:37:26
I remember some of my friends talking about
00:37:28
how free they felt. They could just walk
00:37:30
around in the middle of the night. I
00:37:31
mean, there was actually a lot of freedom
00:37:34
under this very
00:37:36
stern,
00:37:39
authoritarian
00:37:39
rule of Francisco Franco, Taylor?
00:37:44
Yeah. And to kind of circle it back
00:37:46
to,
00:37:48
how
00:37:49
we started this,
00:37:51
for me, it's actually,
00:37:53
I grew up thinking of Franco as just
00:37:56
one of the bad guys, and I didn't
00:37:57
really
00:37:58
have any information why, but that's just kind
00:38:01
of how it was presented to me. And
00:38:02
so when I started learning for myself a
00:38:04
few years ago, these same things that you're
00:38:06
saying now, you know, that it was it
00:38:08
was clean, it was safe, you know, people
00:38:10
went to church,
00:38:12
people behaved themselves in public,
00:38:14
you know, the the economy did really well.
00:38:17
You know, it's just like, well,
00:38:19
what's what's the those are all good things.
00:38:21
You know? That's that's what I want, as
00:38:23
well. And and so that kind of started
00:38:26
me on on the path of of taking
00:38:28
a second look at some of these things.
00:38:30
Sure. And and so let let's do a
00:38:32
the, the complete pivot now, Taylor, back to
00:38:35
the the question of,
00:38:37
the hour of decision we are in today
00:38:41
in America and particularly the angst of the
00:38:43
youth
00:38:44
as they look around and see a health
00:38:46
care system failing,
00:38:48
a retirement system they're never gonna get a
00:38:50
dime of,
00:38:51
the unlikelihood
00:38:52
that they're gonna be able to buy a
00:38:54
house
00:38:55
unless they come from the upper classes,
00:38:58
the danger that is now lurking in all
00:39:01
these cities they got lured into, all these
00:39:03
tech workers,
00:39:04
with the gentrification
00:39:06
they moved. I can I remember this in
00:39:08
Seattle, and I saw it in San Francisco?
00:39:10
And now they're in really dangerous places
00:39:13
with really expensive real estate if they happen
00:39:16
to own any real estate or just ungodly
00:39:18
rent.
00:39:19
If they're renting, it just
00:39:21
and that's just the beginning of the dysfunction
00:39:25
of our society right now that has by
00:39:27
far its greatest impact
00:39:29
on the youth
00:39:31
and with all the information that youth can
00:39:33
get today.
00:39:34
You know,
00:39:36
I I talked about this in an earlier,
00:39:40
episode.
00:39:41
I had never heard of the USS Liberty
00:39:44
till I was in college.
00:39:46
I'd never even heard of it, and I
00:39:47
was
00:39:48
politically active. Even in high school, I was
00:39:51
pretty well read. I was interested in things.
00:39:54
But those three networks, you know, Walter Cronkite
00:39:57
and Huntley and Brinkley and,
00:40:00
Peter Jennings, they didn't talk about some of
00:40:03
these issues. If they if they, stepped on
00:40:05
the toes of people in the establishment, and
00:40:08
they were like the sole almost the sole
00:40:10
source of news along with the wire services
00:40:13
feeding the newspapers. But now,
00:40:16
the youth I mean, you can't you can't
00:40:18
keep things away from them.
00:40:20
They know about these things historically.
00:40:22
And,
00:40:24
you know, they don't as I said earlier,
00:40:26
they don't want the old
00:40:28
establishment line anymore from the Republicans or anybody
00:40:31
else.
00:40:32
And they're looking for some order in a
00:40:34
very disorderly,
00:40:37
situation
00:40:38
with a future that looks pretty dark to
00:40:40
a lot of them. But I'm gonna let
00:40:41
you comment because, I'm talking kind of about
00:40:43
your generation here.
00:40:46
Yeah. I mean, I think you're you're really
00:40:48
have your your finger on the pulse. I
00:40:50
mean, you know, when
00:40:51
people
00:40:53
in my age and and younger,
00:40:56
like you're saying, they they just grow up
00:40:58
in a country where it's it's it's very
00:41:00
obvious that fry
00:41:02
foreigners are prioritized.
00:41:04
You know? There's there's no
00:41:06
security in regards to crime, immigration.
00:41:09
You know, it's increasingly harder to get jobs.
00:41:12
Your education is increasingly worth less and less.
00:41:15
It's harder to get married. It's harder to
00:41:17
own a house, all of this.
00:41:18
So, you know, people will will start looking
00:41:21
for answers. They'll start looking for alternatives. There's
00:41:24
they'll start
00:41:25
asking questions about how we got here.
00:41:28
And,
00:41:29
you know, to to a large extent, the
00:41:31
political establishment
00:41:33
justifies itself on,
00:41:36
the,
00:41:37
you
00:41:38
know, being
00:41:40
having defeated fascism, having defeated people like Franco
00:41:43
and and Mussolini.
00:41:45
And so, well, you know, if the people
00:41:46
are are saying that, you know, we're we're
00:41:48
the good guys, we're the the moral side
00:41:51
because we defeated fascism, and people are saying,
00:41:54
well, this translates to just like, you know,
00:41:57
the very
00:41:59
just things not working,
00:42:00
in practical terms for me and and, frankly,
00:42:03
like, a anti American form of government, then,
00:42:05
well, then maybe I'll take a look at
00:42:07
fascism and see what that was all about.
00:42:09
And or I'll take a look at Franco
00:42:11
and see what, you know, what, actually was
00:42:13
going on there in Spain
00:42:15
at that time, and and then, you know,
00:42:17
they do that. And then, well, I'll it
00:42:19
looks like this is actually about, you know,
00:42:21
restoring traditional values. It looks like it's about
00:42:24
order. It's about patriotism and nationalism and,
00:42:28
creating a country where you can have a
00:42:29
sense of pride and where it works for
00:42:31
the citizenry. And so that's
00:42:33
I mean, those are those are attractive things.
00:42:35
Those are things everyone wants. And and,
00:42:38
to an extent, this is also just a
00:42:39
matter of, you know,
00:42:42
political tactics and ideological tactics and what kinds
00:42:46
of philosophies actually make for, you know, effective
00:42:49
governance.
00:42:50
And, again, you know, there's certainly a a
00:42:53
very, very much a lack of effective governance.
00:42:55
And in many cases, there's just outright malice
00:42:58
toward,
00:42:59
the, you know, the people of The United
00:43:02
States.
00:43:03
And so it's natural to look at, at
00:43:05
some of these things
00:43:06
and,
00:43:07
you know, see in them some some value
00:43:10
that we could wish was applied here as
00:43:12
well.
00:43:13
Sure. And and I think,
00:43:15
I mean, honestly, even though I'm I'm patting
00:43:18
the youth on the back that,
00:43:20
that if they want to, there is a
00:43:22
lot of information for them
00:43:24
to capture now, to be exposed to now
00:43:27
that,
00:43:28
that my generation,
00:43:30
when they were young, they were not exposed
00:43:32
to. Of course, they were all with they
00:43:34
were also busy being a bunch of heatiness
00:43:35
and everything too. But but, anyway,
00:43:38
but, I I mean, I have to say,
00:43:40
I think it's kind of the,
00:43:44
I I don't know that I don't think
00:43:45
there's a lot of depth in the idea
00:43:47
of saying, where's our Franco? I think they
00:43:49
just see somebody
00:43:50
who took a chaotic situation,
00:43:53
a dangerous situation,
00:43:55
brought total order to it. That was an
00:43:58
absolute
00:43:58
boss,
00:43:59
as they would say today,
00:44:01
took charge, but then turned
00:44:03
the government over,
00:44:06
to,
00:44:07
unfortunately, to a bunch of communist. But but,
00:44:10
ideally,
00:44:11
in his mind, you know, Franco did not
00:44:14
want to,
00:44:15
he did not want to be a dictator
00:44:17
or have his successors be dictators for the
00:44:19
next several hundred years.
00:44:21
He wanted to return to,
00:44:24
a the Spanish Republic,
00:44:26
to the Spanish monarchy,
00:44:28
and,
00:44:29
he had no desire kinda like George Washington,
00:44:33
had no desire to become a king.
00:44:36
You know, he had no desire to really
00:44:38
become a king either. And I I think
00:44:41
that's where the
00:44:42
appeal might lie.
00:44:45
You know, who knows? People are responding to
00:44:47
Mark Mitchell.
00:44:48
But, you know,
00:44:49
it was noteworthy to him.
00:44:52
And, you know, he waxed on that for
00:44:54
a few minutes on Steve Bannon's show, I
00:44:56
know. And Bannon is saying, boy, we're gonna
00:44:58
make some headlines here
00:45:00
talking about Franco in a positive way.
00:45:03
But,
00:45:04
I I I think that just the just
00:45:06
the idea of selfless dedication
00:45:08
to the nation
00:45:10
and,
00:45:11
with the idea of just restoring
00:45:13
the order and sanity that people, at least
00:45:16
in their minds, have about what this country
00:45:18
is about. I think I think that's where
00:45:20
the appeal is, but what do you think?
00:45:22
Yeah. I mean, I think that's that's definitely
00:45:24
a huge part of it because, you know,
00:45:26
it's just it's it's just very natural that
00:45:28
that you would want that and that,
00:45:30
you know, if if
00:45:32
that's not what you have, then, you know,
00:45:34
that's
00:45:36
a really unfair state of affairs. I mean,
00:45:39
like I said earlier, Franco, really, he was
00:45:42
he was a man of his time. He
00:45:43
was a a man of the hour. And
00:45:45
so if you you talk about, the kind
00:45:47
of,
00:45:48
what's happened to Spain since his death, it's
00:45:52
you know, there's
00:45:53
I personally don't think that that's
00:45:57
so much
00:45:59
his fault. You know? He was kind of
00:46:00
at that point, Spain was very much on
00:46:02
the international stage, very much, isolated ideologically even
00:46:06
though it was a NATO ally, even though
00:46:08
it had been useful,
00:46:10
against communism through the cold war. But, you
00:46:13
know, you had the ascendancy just of of
00:46:15
left wing and liberal politics worldwide, including in
00:46:19
the West. And,
00:46:20
you know, unfortunately,
00:46:23
just as as its own outlier, Spain couldn't
00:46:26
really survive, I think, at that point,
00:46:29
with the,
00:46:30
the kind of ideology that that he represented.
00:46:33
So, you know, he didn't really have a
00:46:34
good successor.
00:46:36
And, the king, I think I believe he
00:46:39
actually,
00:46:40
wanted to give it over to the king,
00:46:42
but the king just abdicated and and, you
00:46:44
know, set it back to to liberalism,
00:46:47
to the current,
00:46:49
republican form of government,
00:46:51
and which, as we know, is now dominated
00:46:53
once again by the left and by the
00:46:55
socialists who are bringing in migrants from Africa
00:46:59
and The Middle East and,
00:47:01
you know, are certainly not doing any favors
00:47:04
for Spain's economy. So I I think the
00:47:07
the lesson is is really that you just
00:47:09
you always have to fight. You know, the
00:47:10
fight never ends, and you have to just
00:47:12
be willing to keep confronting,
00:47:15
evil and and fighting for your country,
00:47:18
at any time. 100%. And I'm gonna stop
00:47:21
you right there because, Taylor, I want you
00:47:23
to give a pitch for Antelope Hill publishing
00:47:26
company before we say goodbye here.
00:47:29
Well, you've been talking about how people are
00:47:31
are looking at, history, and so I'd
00:47:34
that's that's why we're here really is is
00:47:36
to,
00:47:37
publish books that no one else wants to
00:47:39
publish or that would otherwise be censored or,
00:47:43
we have a lot of books that are
00:47:45
original translations of hours into English from languages
00:47:49
like German, Spanish,
00:47:51
Hungarian,
00:47:53
Russian,
00:47:54
plenty of others.
00:47:56
So,
00:47:57
you know, if you wanna learn more about
00:47:58
history, especially the history of the twentieth century
00:48:00
and you you wanna read people in their
00:48:03
own words, you wanna get their own perspectives
00:48:05
from that time, what they were thinking about
00:48:07
things, then head over to antelopehillpublishing.com,
00:48:11
and, you'll find our whole catalog there. You'll
00:48:13
find all the books that I referenced.
00:48:17
The our four books on Spain, three of
00:48:19
them are bundled together
00:48:21
in the Spanish collection, which you get a
00:48:24
little bit of a discount if you wanna
00:48:25
buy those three together. Then like I said,
00:48:27
one of the most recent is Jose Antonio
00:48:30
Fascist,
00:48:31
which we just recently put out, and you
00:48:33
also have the,
00:48:35
Empire Eternal book, which, I also,
00:48:38
referenced,
00:48:39
earlier in the show. Right. Taylor Taylor, we're
00:48:41
gonna have to leave it there. Thank you
00:48:43
so much
00:48:44
for your time today sharing your insights on
00:48:46
these things. Folks, go to Al O'Pill Publishing.
00:48:49
Check out some of these books.
00:48:51
My name is Lou Moore, and you have
00:48:53
been listening to the hour of decision
00:48:55
on Liberty News Radio, and we will talk
00:48:57
to you again
00:48:58
next week.