Point of View October 9, 2024 – Hour 1 : Don’t Follow Your Heart

[00:00:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Across America, Live, this is Point of View, Kirby Anderson.

[00:00:20] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, sometimes here on Point of View we take on some of those slogans and those clichés that you hear.

[00:00:26] [SPEAKER_00]: You need to trust your emotions, you have to, in a sense, know how to live your life, your own life,

[00:00:33] [SPEAKER_00]: and maybe you should really live your own truth and you should trust yourself and not let anybody else try to oppress you.

[00:00:41] [SPEAKER_00]: All sorts of different phrases that we've mentioned over the years.

[00:00:45] [SPEAKER_00]: And we are going to spend some time today digging into a book that takes on, if you will, those Ten Commandments of Self-Worship.

[00:00:53] [SPEAKER_00]: It is written by Dr. Thaddeus Williams who's been on the program with us before as we've talked about his book,

[00:00:59] [SPEAKER_00]: Confronting Injustice Without Compromising Truth.

[00:01:02] [SPEAKER_00]: And some of the individuals that have endorsed the book, Sean McDowell, Natasha Crane, J.P. Moreland,

[00:01:09] [SPEAKER_00]: as well as a forward by Carl Truman, and also some incredible voices from individuals that you will hear about

[00:01:16] [SPEAKER_00]: that actually give their own testimony and spend some time really addressing some of these very important issues as well.

[00:01:23] [SPEAKER_00]: So I think you're going to find it very helpful, and so we're going to hear voices of Josh McDowell and Alicia Childers

[00:01:30] [SPEAKER_00]: and just a number of other people that have been on the program.

[00:01:33] [SPEAKER_00]: Dr. Thaddeus Williams is also the professor of theology at Biola University, author of that previous book that I mentioned,

[00:01:41] [SPEAKER_00]: has his Ph.D. from Vriesia University in Amsterdam.

[00:01:45] [SPEAKER_00]: And so, Dr. Thaddeus Williams, welcome back to Point of View.

[00:01:49] [SPEAKER_03]: Thank you, Kirby. It's a joy to be back with you, brother.

[00:01:52] [SPEAKER_00]: Talk about the origin of the book, because some of these particular phrases we've dealt with in some depth

[00:01:59] [SPEAKER_00]: with individuals like I just mentioned, like Alicia Childers and her book and others.

[00:02:06] [SPEAKER_00]: But this whole concept, I think, is helpful because what you're saying is,

[00:02:10] [SPEAKER_00]: is if you really make these your life verses, you're first of all not going to be following Christ,

[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_00]: and second of all, you're probably going to ruin your life.

[00:02:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, absolutely. My direct inspiration for this book came from my daughter, Holland, who we call Dutch for short.

[00:02:28] [SPEAKER_03]: And here in the Williams home, we play a little game called Spot the Lie,

[00:02:31] [SPEAKER_03]: a game I picked up from a great Christian thinker, culture commentator, Oz Guinness,

[00:02:37] [SPEAKER_03]: where if kids are watching something and they can point out a falsehood, explain why it's false, they earn one dollar.

[00:02:44] [SPEAKER_03]: So this is going back three or four years ago, and little Dutch comes bounding joyfully down the stairs.

[00:02:50] [SPEAKER_03]: Daddy, daddy, you owe me another dollar.

[00:02:53] [SPEAKER_03]: What'd you find this time, darling?

[00:02:55] [SPEAKER_03]: And she had been watching a commercial for some, I don't know, rainbow pixie fairy unicorn, whatever.

[00:03:02] [SPEAKER_03]: And she said, Daddy, the commercial told me to follow my heart.

[00:03:06] [SPEAKER_03]: I said, okay, well, Spot the Lie.

[00:03:08] [SPEAKER_03]: And her exact response was, Daddy, I don't want to follow my heart.

[00:03:13] [SPEAKER_03]: My heart is fallen.

[00:03:15] [SPEAKER_03]: I'd way rather follow God's heart.

[00:03:18] [SPEAKER_03]: And I just got all warm and fuzzy and filled with joy inside, wrapped my arms around her.

[00:03:24] [SPEAKER_03]: She earned five bucks for that one.

[00:03:27] [SPEAKER_03]: Well-deserved, well-deserved $5.

[00:03:30] [SPEAKER_03]: But that was a direct inspiration for the book, realizing, especially as a father, you know, my wife and I have four kids,

[00:03:36] [SPEAKER_03]: seeing how all the entertainment, so much of the politics, so much of education,

[00:03:44] [SPEAKER_03]: so much of society is beating the same drum to look within for answers and be true to yourself.

[00:03:52] [SPEAKER_03]: And you have a moral duty to be authentic to your emotions and seeing it everywhere and realizing, man, as Christians,

[00:03:59] [SPEAKER_03]: we need to push back and echo Dutch's insight that following God's heart is far superior to following our own fallen hearts.

[00:04:08] [SPEAKER_00]: I love the story that, of course, you tell about your daughter Holland, Dutch for short.

[00:04:12] [SPEAKER_00]: And I thought it was interesting because you said we really need a generation of heretics, iconoclasts, renegades, mavericks,

[00:04:19] [SPEAKER_00]: and rebels who refuse to march like good little cows mooing in unison with the herd.

[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_00]: And so we're going to take on some of those things that are so significant.

[00:04:28] [SPEAKER_00]: And there are ten, and we'll do our best to try to cover all ten in the hour that we have.

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_00]: But let's take the first one.

[00:04:34] [SPEAKER_00]: Again, live your best life.

[00:04:35] [SPEAKER_00]: Thou shall always act in accordance with your chief end to glorify and enjoy yourself forever.

[00:04:43] [SPEAKER_00]: That's a great line.

[00:04:45] [SPEAKER_00]: And again, this idea of living your best life, there is a truth part.

[00:04:49] [SPEAKER_00]: Each one of these have some aspect of truth to them.

[00:04:52] [SPEAKER_00]: The problem is when that's the core of your being, and there's where the mistake is actually made, isn't it?

[00:04:58] [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.

[00:04:59] [SPEAKER_03]: So when it comes to living your best life, I'm drawing from some research, especially out of the Barna Research Group,

[00:05:08] [SPEAKER_03]: that found that 84% of Americans, I mean, that's a sweeping majority, 84% said that the chief end of man,

[00:05:17] [SPEAKER_03]: the highest goal in life is to make yourself happy, right?

[00:05:22] [SPEAKER_03]: So we've inverted the Westminster Catechism.

[00:05:25] [SPEAKER_03]: That's what you're saying.

[00:05:26] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_03]: Glorify and enjoy ourselves.

[00:05:28] [SPEAKER_03]: 86% said to make yourself happy, do what you desire most.

[00:05:34] [SPEAKER_03]: And then a whopping 91% said to find the answers, look within for answers.

[00:05:41] [SPEAKER_03]: And so this cult of self-worship, I mean, it has plenty of adherence.

[00:05:47] [SPEAKER_03]: The overwhelming majority of Americans are practicing this faith, this false gospel of self-gratification.

[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_03]: And part of what I argue in that first chapter is, you know, at the end of the day, human beings are hardwired for awe.

[00:06:06] [SPEAKER_03]: We don't just want to marvel and to be awestruck.

[00:06:10] [SPEAKER_03]: We actually need to be awestruck by something exponentially bigger than ourselves.

[00:06:17] [SPEAKER_03]: And this is where the cult of self-worship robs us of awe, because in the final analysis,

[00:06:24] [SPEAKER_03]: we're just not as awesome as we'd like to think.

[00:06:28] [SPEAKER_03]: We're especially, you know, we're near as awesome as the infinite, all-knowing, sovereign, triune creator of the universe.

[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_03]: And so by telling people to make themselves the center point, they're settling.

[00:06:41] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, it's Lewis's old insight that we are like a little kid playing with mud pies in a slum because we can't imagine a holiday at sea.

[00:06:50] [SPEAKER_03]: And so we're trying to live our best lives by making ourselves the center of it deprives us of the awe and adventure of following God.

[00:06:58] [SPEAKER_00]: You also talk about how science is catching up to scripture, but I would even say that popular opinion is starting to catch up to it.

[00:07:06] [SPEAKER_00]: One of the interviews we've done, it's a couple of years ago, is on the book, The Coddling of the American Mind.

[00:07:11] [SPEAKER_00]: Now, one of the authors on there, matter of fact, both of them certainly could not sign the doctrinal statement of your church.

[00:07:18] [SPEAKER_00]: And in particular, Jonathan Hyde doesn't even refer to himself as a conservative or a Christian or even necessarily a theist.

[00:07:25] [SPEAKER_00]: But you're still seeing individuals now recognizing that if this is all there is to life, really doesn't work very well.

[00:07:35] [SPEAKER_00]: And just before we take a break, let me just mention that each chapter then has a heretic.

[00:07:39] [SPEAKER_00]: In this case, the heretic is Johnny Erickson Tata.

[00:07:42] [SPEAKER_00]: You then have a heretic's prayer, a heretic field manual, and just a variety of other aspects of scripture.

[00:07:49] [SPEAKER_00]: So, again, we're going to be looking at, if you will, these Ten Commandments of Self-Worship.

[00:07:55] [SPEAKER_00]: This book is published by Zondervan.

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_00]: If you'd like to know more about, certainly Thaddeus Williams, you can go to the website, pointofview.net.

[00:08:04] [SPEAKER_00]: If you'd like to know more about this book, which, again, I think you can find in your local bookstore.

[00:08:08] [SPEAKER_00]: We have information about that so that you can go to our website at pointofview.net.

[00:08:13] [SPEAKER_00]: But we'll work our way through some of these very significant Ten Commandments.

[00:08:18] [SPEAKER_00]: We've looked at the first one, Live Your Best Life.

[00:08:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we'll come back and talk about things like be true to yourself, follow your heart,

[00:08:26] [SPEAKER_00]: all sorts of other issues that are part of the culture, the popular culture,

[00:08:32] [SPEAKER_00]: which, unfortunately, Christians have bought into and really need to counter-program not only in their lives,

[00:08:39] [SPEAKER_00]: but in the lives of their children and grandchildren.

[00:08:42] [SPEAKER_00]: So we'll continue our conversation right after this.

[00:08:58] [SPEAKER_01]: This is Viewpoints with Kirby Anderson.

[00:09:02] [SPEAKER_00]: A recent story from CBN News reports that there have been a fourth major collegiate revival in the last month.

[00:09:08] [SPEAKER_00]: According to the story, thousands of students gathered at the University of Arkansas on Thursday night

[00:09:13] [SPEAKER_00]: to seek Jesus Christ and find salvation in His name.

[00:09:17] [SPEAKER_00]: Unite U.S. reports that 10,000 students from 67 different universities gathered in Bud Walton Arena.

[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_00]: One young man shared his powerful testimony right before getting baptized at the event, saying,

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_00]: I spent a lot of years running from God.

[00:09:30] [SPEAKER_00]: I just came to Jesus about five weeks ago, but I got caught up in, I'll just say, cocaine and alcohol.

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_00]: I had a lot of really near-death experiences, and I think Jesus had His hand on my life because I should not be here.

[00:09:42] [SPEAKER_00]: The other campuses reporting a revival last month include the University of South Carolina,

[00:09:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Texas A&M at Corpus Christi, and Ohio State University.

[00:09:50] [SPEAKER_00]: You are probably also aware of the major revival that took place on the campus of Asbury College in early 2023.

[00:09:58] [SPEAKER_00]: Jerry Newcomb wonders if the recent campus revivals will spill over to the nation.

[00:10:02] [SPEAKER_00]: He reminds us that poll after poll documents that millions of Americans feel the country is headed in the wrong direction.

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_00]: He goes on to argue that there's a great need for a national revival, and then reminds us of the First Great Awakening.

[00:10:15] [SPEAKER_00]: That revival began in the 1730s with the preaching of Reverend Jonathan Edwards and spread through the colonies due to the work of traveling evangelist George Whitefield.

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_00]: He quotes Benjamin Franklin and John Adams who witnessed the impact of the revivals that led to the Great Awakening.

[00:10:32] [SPEAKER_00]: America needs a revival and a reformation.

[00:10:35] [SPEAKER_00]: I pray that what is happening on campus will spread to the rest of the country.

[00:10:38] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm Kirby Anderson, and that's my Point of View.

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_01]: For a free copy of Kirby's booklet, A Biblical View on Antisemitism, go to viewpoints.info slash antisemitism.

[00:10:54] [SPEAKER_01]: viewpoints.info slash antisemitism.

[00:10:59] [SPEAKER_01]: You're listening to Point of View, your listener-supported source for truth.

[00:11:05] [SPEAKER_00]: Continue your conversation today with Dr. Thaddeus Williams.

[00:11:07] [SPEAKER_00]: Let me just mention this book published by Zondervan came out a couple months ago, so you can find it probably in your local bookstore.

[00:11:13] [SPEAKER_00]: But if not, we have a link to it on our website at pointofview.net, and you could get it either in paperback or Kindle.

[00:11:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Don't follow your heart, boldly breaking the Ten Commandments of Self-Worship.

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about this idea of living your best life, but let's get to the next one.

[00:11:30] [SPEAKER_00]: And that is, okay, Boomer, thou shalt never be outdated, but always on the edge of new.

[00:11:37] [SPEAKER_00]: And there is sort of a chronological snobbery here.

[00:11:41] [SPEAKER_00]: New is always better than old, but that's not true either, is it?

[00:11:45] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, just this last year's Grammys was a huge spectacle of self-worship.

[00:11:53] [SPEAKER_03]: When one of the headline acts was Sam Smith with singer Kim Petras, and they did sort of a simulated occultic devil worship ceremony.

[00:12:07] [SPEAKER_03]: And the whole thing was about, you know, this is so edgy and innovative and, you know, exalt yourself and follow your emotions and all this stuff.

[00:12:17] [SPEAKER_03]: And I just watched sort of laughing, thinking, man, they keep marketing this stuff to so cutting edge.

[00:12:25] [SPEAKER_03]: This be true to yourself, define yourself garbage is literally the oldest lie in the book.

[00:12:31] [SPEAKER_03]: So in Chapter 2, I go all the way back to our first parents, Adam and Eve, in Genesis 3,

[00:12:38] [SPEAKER_03]: where it says in verse 5, the serpent's original temptation is, hey, you can be, the text reads, like God, knowing good and evil.

[00:12:50] [SPEAKER_03]: And I do some homework from the Hebrew there to show that knowing doesn't mean it's not book knowledge,

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_03]: it's not experiential knowledge, it's something else.

[00:13:01] [SPEAKER_03]: It's a very particular Hebrew turn of phrase that carries a sense of, I know it because I made it that way.

[00:13:08] [SPEAKER_03]: It's a maker's knowledge.

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_03]: It's having the sovereignty to determine something to define its meaning.

[00:13:17] [SPEAKER_03]: And so Satan's original temptation is you'll be like God, knowing, having sovereign defining authority over,

[00:13:24] [SPEAKER_03]: and then it says good and evil, which isn't just moral categories.

[00:13:30] [SPEAKER_03]: If we hopped in a time machine and went back to the ancient Near East,

[00:13:34] [SPEAKER_03]: ancient Jews would use polar opposites to describe everything in between.

[00:13:40] [SPEAKER_03]: So ancient Jews might say black and whites referring to every color.

[00:13:45] [SPEAKER_03]: Ancient Jews might say the Beatles and Nickelback to refer to every rock band.

[00:13:52] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, the best and, sorry, Nickelback fans, probably the worst.

[00:13:57] [SPEAKER_03]: And so this language of good and evil is ancient Jewish shorthand for everything.

[00:14:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And so that's originally the oldest lie in the book.

[00:14:09] [SPEAKER_03]: You, finite creature that you are, can be the knowing maker, the sovereign definer of your whole universe.

[00:14:17] [SPEAKER_03]: You can define your biology.

[00:14:19] [SPEAKER_03]: You can define the meaning of marriage.

[00:14:21] [SPEAKER_03]: You can fabricate your own meaning of life.

[00:14:25] [SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah, it's just false advertising that what we're dealing with here is anything new or innovative.

[00:14:31] [SPEAKER_00]: So good.

[00:14:32] [SPEAKER_00]: And, again, I might just mention in each one of the chapters there is, of course, a testimony, which is always very good.

[00:14:38] [SPEAKER_00]: And then just a little bit of a suggestion on a heretics prayer and a heretics field manual.

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_00]: But let's get to the title of your book.

[00:14:45] [SPEAKER_00]: That's the third chapter.

[00:14:46] [SPEAKER_00]: Follow Your Heart.

[00:14:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Thou shalt obey your emotions at all costs.

[00:14:51] [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that always works out well.

[00:14:53] [SPEAKER_00]: Trust your emotions.

[00:14:54] [SPEAKER_00]: And, again, this is a good corollary to one book I mentioned, The Coddling of the American Mind.

[00:15:00] [SPEAKER_00]: But many other books over the years that we've talked about or done interviews on because this idea of trusting your emotions is always a disaster.

[00:15:09] [SPEAKER_00]: And yet that describes, unfortunately, a good portion of the younger generation.

[00:15:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I'm glad you referenced, The Coddling of the American Mind, because what Height and Lukanoff are up to there, part of their project is to explain why are rates of suicidal ideation, rates of anxiety disorders, rates of depression, why are all of these negative outcomes skyrocketing, especially in the last about nine years?

[00:15:43] [SPEAKER_03]: There's been a really significant spike.

[00:15:46] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[00:15:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And they advance some, I think, really helpful explanatory factors.

[00:15:52] [SPEAKER_03]: Something they don't cover, but the way my research sort of supplements theirs, is if I'm being told to follow my heart, then what's really being said is I need to be my own functional deity.

[00:16:06] [SPEAKER_03]: I need to be, you know, like Genesis 3-5, the ultimate definer of good and evil, my whole self.

[00:16:14] [SPEAKER_03]: And so now what happens is young people think they're just watching a cute animated potato singing about follow your heart or a Disney princess telling you to be true to yourself.

[00:16:27] [SPEAKER_03]: What's really happening is they are now having the impossible weight of constructing and sustaining an identity over time, a God-sized weight foisted on their finite shoulders.

[00:16:43] [SPEAKER_03]: And what happens is we're just creatures, not the creator.

[00:16:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And so people buckle under that impossible weight.

[00:16:50] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, follow your heart.

[00:16:52] [SPEAKER_03]: What does that even mean?

[00:16:53] [SPEAKER_03]: My heart, you know, Lewis makes the point in Abolition of Man, using the language of instincts.

[00:17:01] [SPEAKER_03]: C.S. Lewis says telling somebody to follow their instincts is like telling them to follow people.

[00:17:08] [SPEAKER_03]: People say different things, and so do our instincts.

[00:17:11] [SPEAKER_03]: And the same holds true of our feelings, emotions.

[00:17:14] [SPEAKER_03]: Our emotions are not a unified chorus with a single melody and harmony.

[00:17:22] [SPEAKER_03]: It's a clashing cacophony of competing desires and emotions.

[00:17:26] [SPEAKER_03]: So which one is your true, quote-unquote, heart?

[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_03]: And so it's terrible advice because it leads to this chronic identity crisis where you're putting an impossible weight on your finite and often shifting emotions.

[00:17:43] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, so again, that one, of course, be you a fall in your heart also kind of ties into this idea of be true to yourself.

[00:17:49] [SPEAKER_00]: Thou shall be courageous enough to defy others' expectations.

[00:17:54] [SPEAKER_00]: And it does seem to me that that one also is so significant.

[00:17:58] [SPEAKER_00]: Matter of fact, the Heretic's Testimony is by J.P. Moreland.

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_00]: He's been on the program before.

[00:18:03] [SPEAKER_00]: He'll be on with us later in the week.

[00:18:04] [SPEAKER_00]: And it is, again, this idea that you've got to serve someone, so, you know, might as well serve yourself.

[00:18:12] [SPEAKER_00]: And in that regard, you can defy others' expectations for you.

[00:18:16] [SPEAKER_00]: You don't need to live by those rules.

[00:18:18] [SPEAKER_00]: You don't need to live by external rules.

[00:18:20] [SPEAKER_00]: You just live according to what you think is right.

[00:18:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, here we find more of that false advertising where the command to be true to yourself.

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Let's take a scenario where, let's say, a hypothetical teenager named Jane has within her quote-unquote heart, she finds competing emotions.

[00:18:42] [SPEAKER_03]: She finds a set of emotions beckoning her towards a life of sexual monogamy and committed marriage, having and raising children.

[00:18:54] [SPEAKER_03]: And then she has a competing set of desires, you know, maybe to be promiscuous and to explore, you know, sexual liaisons with many anonymous partners,

[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_03]: explore her sexuality beyond the confines of heterosexuality or something like that.

[00:19:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Now, if somebody's coming along and telling her to follow her heart, it's very clear which set of those desires the cultural process and propagandists really want her to follow.

[00:19:30] [SPEAKER_03]: They really want her to follow her heart by having sex with everything that moves.

[00:19:37] [SPEAKER_03]: There's a hidden agenda behind it that markets itself as autonomy and self-rule.

[00:19:44] [SPEAKER_03]: In that chapter, I show that by following your heart, you are on your knees to such ideologues as Michel Foucault, the French postmodernist.

[00:19:56] [SPEAKER_03]: You're on your knees to the gender ideologues like John Money and Alfred Kinsey and Wilhelm Reich and Jean-Paul Sartre.

[00:20:05] [SPEAKER_03]: You're doing the unwitting bidding of Friedrich Nietzsche, Aleister Crowley and others.

[00:20:12] [SPEAKER_03]: There is no such thing as this autonomy that's being advertised.

[00:20:16] [SPEAKER_03]: What happens is young people are convinced or duped into thinking they're being some courageous space monkey doing their own thing,

[00:20:25] [SPEAKER_03]: when in reality they're cows in the herd following these rather unsavory ideologues.

[00:20:33] [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. As you said, mooing with the crowd.

[00:20:36] [SPEAKER_00]: And again, Jesus warned in Matthew 7 about false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves.

[00:20:43] [SPEAKER_00]: You will recognize them by their fruits.

[00:20:46] [SPEAKER_00]: And of course, you give us a long list from Nero to Jean-Paul Sartre and Jean-Jacques Rousseau and Friedrich Nietzsche and Michel Foucault and Timothy Leary and on and on and on.

[00:20:57] [SPEAKER_00]: And so again, let's take a break. And we are talking today about Don't Follow Your Heart, Boldly Breaking the Ten Commandments of Self-Worship.

[00:21:06] [SPEAKER_00]: Dr. Thaddeus Williams is the author of this. It is published by Zondervan.

[00:21:10] [SPEAKER_00]: You probably can find it in your local bookstore.

[00:21:12] [SPEAKER_00]: But if not, we have information about that on our website at pointofview.net so that you could order it either in paperback or Kindle.

[00:21:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Might be a good book to give to some young people that have maybe drunk deeply from some of these false ideas in the culture.

[00:21:28] [SPEAKER_00]: We'll be right back.

[00:21:32] [SPEAKER_01]: There is an old military saying, if you don't have communications, you don't have anything.

[00:21:38] [SPEAKER_01]: Good information is the key to success, not only for those in the military, but for all of us.

[00:21:44] [SPEAKER_01]: You can't take positive, productive, and helpful action if you don't have good information.

[00:21:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Point of View Radio's main role is to provide good information.

[00:21:55] [SPEAKER_01]: And we distribute that information not only here through our radio program, but online and through our various social media channels.

[00:22:03] [SPEAKER_01]: You know that big tech isn't exactly a supporter of what we do, so you need to take intentional steps to keep in touch with us.

[00:22:12] [SPEAKER_01]: Make sure you follow us on Twitter, at Point of View RTS, which of course stands for Point of View Radio Talk Show.

[00:22:20] [SPEAKER_01]: At Point of View RTS.

[00:22:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Also, make sure you follow us on Facebook, Point of View Radio Talk Show.

[00:22:28] [SPEAKER_01]: We won't overwhelm you, usually just one post a day with information on our guests and what's important.

[00:22:34] [SPEAKER_01]: The information you need when you need it.

[00:22:38] [SPEAKER_01]: Point of View Radio Talk Show on Facebook and at Point of View RTS on Twitter.

[00:22:49] [SPEAKER_01]: Point of View will continue after this.

[00:22:53] [SPEAKER_01]: You are listening to Point of View.

[00:23:03] [SPEAKER_01]: The opinions expressed on Point of View do not necessarily reflect the views of the management or staff of this station.

[00:23:11] [SPEAKER_01]: And now, here again, is Kirby Anderson.

[00:23:15] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, today's self-proclaimed lifestyle gurus and TikTok therapists and Internet influencers are really preaching this idea of following your heart, being true to yourself.

[00:23:26] [SPEAKER_00]: And it is, I think, really important for us to know how to begin to respond to that and maybe even help those children and grandchildren and others that we have an influence in to not accept some of these Ten Commandments of self-worship.

[00:23:42] [SPEAKER_00]: So, if you've been following along, we've looked at four of the Ten Chapters.

[00:23:47] [SPEAKER_00]: And we're talking about this today with Dr. Thaddeus Williams.

[00:23:50] [SPEAKER_00]: The book is entitled Don't Follow Your Heart, Boldly Breaking the Ten Commandments of Self-Worship.

[00:23:55] [SPEAKER_00]: It is published by Zondervan.

[00:23:57] [SPEAKER_00]: And let's, if we can, get to Chapter 5.

[00:24:00] [SPEAKER_00]: You do you.

[00:24:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Thou shalt live your truth and let others live theirs.

[00:24:05] [SPEAKER_00]: And, again, this is kind of a, well, you live your life, I live my life.

[00:24:09] [SPEAKER_00]: But I thought it was great that you had a heretics testimonial from Josh McDowell.

[00:24:15] [SPEAKER_00]: Because although it sounds good for everybody to kind of pursue their own truth, there is a truth that is taught in Scripture that is establishing what we as Christians should live.

[00:24:27] [SPEAKER_00]: And yet you have people today that say, live your own truth, maybe true for you but not true for me.

[00:24:34] [SPEAKER_00]: And I think this is perhaps one of the most significant of one of those Ten Commandments of self-worship.

[00:24:40] [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.

[00:24:41] [SPEAKER_03]: And I think it's helpful to just show that if you consistently try to live that, you know, I got my lowercase t truth.

[00:24:48] [SPEAKER_03]: You have your lowercase t truth.

[00:24:50] [SPEAKER_03]: So let's just live and let live.

[00:24:53] [SPEAKER_03]: Different strokes for different folks.

[00:24:57] [SPEAKER_03]: One of the things that we lose in that, under that kind of relativism is any semblance of real moral courage or virtue.

[00:25:08] [SPEAKER_03]: So just this time last week, I was with my family.

[00:25:12] [SPEAKER_03]: I was doing some speaking at Francis Schaeffer's Labrie Ministries in Europe.

[00:25:17] [SPEAKER_03]: And we found ourselves on a stopover in the city of Munich.

[00:25:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And I was able to explain to my kids, you know, that we were on the stomping ground of the White Rose Society, which in the early 30s was started by two Christian college students, Sophia Scholl and her big brother Hans.

[00:25:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And there was a lot of people who were on the rise.

[00:25:42] [SPEAKER_03]: And there was a lot of people who were on the rise.

[00:25:46] [SPEAKER_03]: And said, Jesus, not Hitler, is Lord.

[00:25:51] [SPEAKER_03]: Much like the early church said they risked it all and literally became lion lunch to declare that Jesus, not Caesar, is Lord.

[00:26:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And so they set up the White Rose Society to publish these underground leaflets to expose the evils of Nazism.

[00:26:13] [SPEAKER_03]: And there's something heroic about the Sophie Scholls of history and the Dietrich Bonhoeffers of history and the William Wilberforces and Frederick Douglases and Sojourner Troops and Harriet Tubmans of history.

[00:26:27] [SPEAKER_03]: All of these moral heroes believed in being judgmental, in a sense.

[00:26:34] [SPEAKER_03]: There is a capital T, truth, and a capital G, good, and a capital B, beauty that's worth fighting for and if need be dying for.

[00:26:45] [SPEAKER_03]: And so this relativistic, blase, you do you, it's just lazy and it strips life out of all moral adventure.

[00:26:55] [SPEAKER_03]: And it strips life of all virtue and courage.

[00:27:00] [SPEAKER_00]: So good.

[00:27:01] [SPEAKER_00]: And again, Josh McDowell's testimony there, but I want to keep the train moving down the track.

[00:27:07] [SPEAKER_00]: So let's get to Chapter 6.

[00:27:10] [SPEAKER_00]: YOLO, you know, you only live once.

[00:27:12] [SPEAKER_00]: Thou shalt pursue the rush of boundary-free experience.

[00:27:17] [SPEAKER_00]: Now, nothing wrong with wanting to ski down a slope that you've never been able to ski down before or try something new.

[00:27:26] [SPEAKER_00]: But in the area of morality, it kind of connects up to many of the other chapters you've already written about.

[00:27:33] [SPEAKER_00]: And that is, you want to have every experience without any limits, without any boundaries, without any fences.

[00:27:40] [SPEAKER_00]: And, of course, as G.K. Chesterin was known to say, if you take down a fence, maybe you should ask before you take it down what it was up there for in the first place.

[00:27:49] [SPEAKER_00]: And that, I think, is a culture today that says, I want to live without any boundaries, without any fences.

[00:27:55] [SPEAKER_00]: And yet, the truth of Scripture, as well as the truth of history, is that's a very dangerous kind of lifestyle.

[00:28:03] [SPEAKER_03]: Absolutely.

[00:28:03] [SPEAKER_03]: I think you're right to point out, you know, for a lot of these hashtags, there is a harmless way to interpret many of them, an innocuous way.

[00:28:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Like YOLO, you only live once.

[00:28:16] [SPEAKER_03]: If, you know, I'm sitting at the Hofbrauhaus in Munich, and my seven-year-old boy has never had bratwurst before, and he's terrified of it, I might give him that kind of advice.

[00:28:29] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, hey, you only live once.

[00:28:31] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, go for it.

[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_03]: Try this new experience.

[00:28:35] [SPEAKER_03]: I coach my kids' softball and baseball teams.

[00:28:39] [SPEAKER_03]: If I got a timid little kid walking to home plate, and his bat is quaking and his little heart is thumping, I might tell him to believe in himself.

[00:28:48] [SPEAKER_03]: Like, there's ways to redeem a lot of these.

[00:28:52] [SPEAKER_03]: But as it's become this fully-orbed religion, a cult of self-worship, there is these far more insidious readings of these.

[00:29:00] [SPEAKER_03]: So with YOLO, throw yourself into the unfettered rush of experience.

[00:29:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Part of what we lose here piggybacks on the last point we were making, which is if I am the moral standard, if my heart is sacred and authoritative and unquestionable and sacrosanct, then there's nothing above me to adventure towards, and life becomes impossibly dull.

[00:29:29] [SPEAKER_03]: It's sort of like what the postmodern novelist David Foster Wallace was getting at when he said, you know, under this new kind of you-do-you expressive individualism, Wallace said, yeah, we become kings and queens, like our own meaning makers.

[00:29:46] [SPEAKER_03]: But we're kings and queens of our own tiny skull-sized kingdoms, which I think hits it right on the head.

[00:29:54] [SPEAKER_03]: We're trapped in our own skull-sized kingdoms.

[00:29:56] [SPEAKER_03]: There's no meaning beyond us.

[00:29:59] [SPEAKER_03]: And so YOLO, again, that false advertising, sounds like a call to adventure.

[00:30:04] [SPEAKER_03]: It's actually a sentence to the solitude of your own skull-sized kingdom.

[00:30:11] [SPEAKER_03]: Wow.

[00:30:12] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, let's take a few more.

[00:30:13] [SPEAKER_00]: And Chapter 7, The Answers Are Within.

[00:30:16] [SPEAKER_00]: And that gets us, of course, into this idea that thou shalt trust yourself, never letting anyone oppress you with the antiquated notion of being a sinner.

[00:30:26] [SPEAKER_00]: And, of course, you have almost everything now in the areas of psychology and certainly self-help books and the rest that all want to, of course, rid you of any kind of guilt that you might feel for pursuing something untethered and certainly want to get rid of this concept of a biblical notion of sin.

[00:30:49] Sure.

[00:30:50] [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, anybody who's really put five serious minutes of introspection into looking within for answers will realize pretty darn quickly the answers aren't within.

[00:31:03] [SPEAKER_03]: That's where the problems are.

[00:31:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[00:31:06] [SPEAKER_03]: And part of my impetus for writing the book, you know, being a professor at Biola University, I have in the ballpark of 250 to 300 students a semester.

[00:31:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Most of them would be Gen Z.

[00:31:21] [SPEAKER_03]: And I noticed a shift in the last couple of years of what I can only describe as students taking themselves way too seriously.

[00:31:33] [SPEAKER_03]: Because if the answers are within and I need to now introspect, I need to determine what is my heart saying,

[00:31:40] [SPEAKER_03]: I have a moral obligation to be obedient to my heart, to live authentically, then that pulls students inside themselves where every emotion has to be taken like sacred scripture.

[00:31:54] [SPEAKER_03]: So you better get it right or you're missing out on the real you.

[00:31:58] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's, again, where Lukanoff and Heitz research about, you know, these astronomical peaks of depression and anxiety tick in because we were never designed to take ourselves that seriously.

[00:32:15] [SPEAKER_03]: It's far more freeing to take God seriously.

[00:32:18] [SPEAKER_03]: So you mentioned our mutual friend J.P. Moreland.

[00:32:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Sounds like he's going to be on your show in a couple weeks.

[00:32:26] [SPEAKER_03]: J.P. and I are longtime friends.

[00:32:29] [SPEAKER_03]: He mentored me for over 20 years.

[00:32:32] [SPEAKER_03]: And our office doors at Biola are about a first down away from each other, about 10 yards apart.

[00:32:40] [SPEAKER_03]: And I will often bump into him in the morning.

[00:32:43] [SPEAKER_03]: We're on our way to our class or office hours or something.

[00:32:47] [SPEAKER_03]: And a typical morning greeting I'll get from J.P. will be something like,

[00:32:52] [SPEAKER_03]: Good morning, idiot.

[00:32:57] [SPEAKER_03]: Which some listeners might think, Man, what an insensitive jerk J.P. Moreland must be.

[00:33:02] [SPEAKER_03]: No, no, no.

[00:33:03] [SPEAKER_03]: It's a blessing.

[00:33:04] [SPEAKER_03]: I've known him for 20 years.

[00:33:05] [SPEAKER_03]: And he's extremely good at not only not taking himself seriously, but helping you not be so self-serious.

[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Helping me to realize the universe doesn't orbit around my emotions, but that I'm actually an idiot.

[00:33:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And that is something like G.K. Chesterton was getting at.

[00:33:28] [SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[00:33:28] [SPEAKER_03]: When Chesterton said, Angels can fly because they take themselves so lightly.

[00:33:35] [SPEAKER_00]: That's a great line.

[00:33:36] [SPEAKER_00]: Let's take a break and we'll come back and pick off a few more.

[00:33:39] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't necessarily recommend you say, Good morning, idiot.

[00:33:42] [SPEAKER_00]: But I'll let you figure that out.

[00:33:44] [SPEAKER_00]: And we'll be right back.

[00:33:45] [SPEAKER_01]: You're listening to Point of View, your listener-supported source for truth.

[00:34:02] [SPEAKER_00]: Back for a few more minutes as we talk about the book, Don't Follow Your Heart, Boldly Breaking,

[00:34:06] [SPEAKER_00]: The Ten Commandments of Self-Worship, written by Dr. Thaddeus Williams.

[00:34:10] [SPEAKER_00]: And one of the chapters is about being authentic.

[00:34:13] [SPEAKER_00]: Thou shalt invent and advertise thine own identity.

[00:34:17] [SPEAKER_00]: Got to love an author that one minute is quoting Taylor Swift and the next minute quoting G.K. Chesterton.

[00:34:25] [SPEAKER_00]: Probably a few Swifties know who G.K. Chesterton are.

[00:34:29] [SPEAKER_00]: But nevertheless, it is, again, just this idea of actually pursuing your authentic self.

[00:34:35] [SPEAKER_00]: And that is never one of those, if you will, Ten Commandments of Self-Worship.

[00:34:41] [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I love Chesterton's words that open that chapter.

[00:34:45] [SPEAKER_03]: He says, Christianity came into the world firstly in order to assert with violence that a man had not only to look inwards,

[00:34:54] [SPEAKER_03]: but to look outwards, to behold with astonishment and enthusiasm a divine company and a divine captain.

[00:35:03] [SPEAKER_03]: The only fun of being a Christian, says Chesterton, was that a man was not left alone with the inner light,

[00:35:09] [SPEAKER_03]: but definitely recognized an outer light fair as the sun.

[00:35:13] [SPEAKER_03]: And so that outer light is what gets snuffed out in the cult of self-worship and this kind of expressive individualism.

[00:35:22] [SPEAKER_03]: And so I argue in that chapter that what we now call authenticity, and this is a lot of Charles Taylor's work in a secular age,

[00:35:34] [SPEAKER_03]: he says, you know, we've been through the age of science, we've been through an age of faith.

[00:35:40] [SPEAKER_03]: What are we in now?

[00:35:41] [SPEAKER_03]: And his answer is an age of authenticity where authenticity means a devotion to my emotions,

[00:35:48] [SPEAKER_03]: a devotion to be true to my feelings, to express them, to never repress them.

[00:35:55] [SPEAKER_03]: That's the new hashtag authentic life.

[00:36:01] [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I argue that that's just the wrong word.

[00:36:04] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, it is.

[00:36:05] [SPEAKER_03]: Or if I believe that my emotions are unquestionable, and if I want to cancel anybody who questions my subjective states,

[00:36:15] [SPEAKER_03]: that doesn't make me authentic.

[00:36:17] [SPEAKER_03]: That makes me arrogant.

[00:36:19] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[00:36:20] [SPEAKER_03]: They got the first letter right, just the rest of the word wrong.

[00:36:23] [SPEAKER_03]: It is the height of arrogance to say my feelings can never be questioned.

[00:36:29] [SPEAKER_03]: And so that's one of many problems with 21st century authenticity.

[00:36:34] [SPEAKER_00]: And again, you point that out is the Princess Bride myth, and that is you keep using that word,

[00:36:40] [SPEAKER_00]: but I don't think it means what you think it means, and a great illustration of that as well.

[00:36:44] [SPEAKER_00]: Inspeable.

[00:36:45] [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

[00:36:46] [SPEAKER_00]: Chapter 9, though.

[00:36:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Live the dream.

[00:36:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Thou shalt force the universe to bend to your desires.

[00:36:51] [SPEAKER_00]: In other words, I'm going to live this world.

[00:36:54] [SPEAKER_00]: History will readjust.

[00:36:56] [SPEAKER_00]: The culture will readjust so that I am literally the center of the universe.

[00:37:01] [SPEAKER_00]: And it's not surprising that the heretics testimony there, as Alicia Childers has been on the program with us a number of times,

[00:37:08] [SPEAKER_00]: because this idea of living the dream is, again, just one more example of one of the ten commandments of self-worship.

[00:37:15] [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.

[00:37:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.

[00:37:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Living a dream, this concept, I can create my own – create and inhabit my own moral universe, define my own telos, my own purpose,

[00:37:27] [SPEAKER_03]: my own design, my own reason for being.

[00:37:30] [SPEAKER_03]: This concept from Jean-Paul Sartre that existence precedes essence.

[00:37:35] [SPEAKER_03]: You just exist.

[00:37:36] [SPEAKER_03]: It's on you through a feat of willpower to create your own essence.

[00:37:42] [SPEAKER_03]: I'm reminded of how much of a failure that view is.

[00:37:47] [SPEAKER_03]: From just about a week and a half ago, my family and I trained to a little village in Bavaria in the south of Germany called Rothensburg,

[00:37:59] [SPEAKER_03]: which was the inspiration for Disney's Pinocchio.

[00:38:02] [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[00:38:04] [SPEAKER_03]: And that movie, so to prep for our trip there, I had kids watch Pinocchio again,

[00:38:10] [SPEAKER_03]: and you see the whole quest of Pinocchio is to become a real boy.

[00:38:16] [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[00:38:17] [SPEAKER_03]: Right?

[00:38:18] [SPEAKER_03]: Not a puppet.

[00:38:19] [SPEAKER_03]: He wants to be a real boy.

[00:38:20] [SPEAKER_03]: And so he has this voice of conscience, right?

[00:38:24] [SPEAKER_03]: Personified as this little crooning green cricket, right?

[00:38:29] [SPEAKER_03]: What's his name?

[00:38:30] [SPEAKER_03]: Jiminy.

[00:38:30] [SPEAKER_00]: Jiminy Cricket.

[00:38:31] [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.

[00:38:31] [SPEAKER_03]: And the extent to which Pinocchio shuns the voice of conscience to go off and join Stromboli to seek fame and fortune,

[00:38:41] [SPEAKER_03]: and then to lie about it, he becomes less of a boy, more of a tree, right?

[00:38:46] [SPEAKER_03]: His nose sprouts into a tree branch.

[00:38:49] [SPEAKER_03]: When he shuns his family and all of his responsibilities to go off to Pleasure Island, he makes a donkey of himself.

[00:38:57] [SPEAKER_03]: He sprouts ears and starts braying and gets a donkey tail.

[00:39:02] [SPEAKER_03]: And the message, even when I was watching that, this little five-year-old fad, I probably couldn't have articulated it then,

[00:39:10] [SPEAKER_03]: but it was there's a way to be a real boy and there's a way to make a donkey out of yourself.

[00:39:15] [SPEAKER_03]: And by ignoring your moral duties and responsibilities, you become less boy-like.

[00:39:23] [SPEAKER_03]: And so the finale sequence of the movie is when this wooden boy aligns himself with heroism, with courage.

[00:39:31] [SPEAKER_03]: He sets out to find his dad, Geppetto.

[00:39:33] [SPEAKER_03]: He takes on Monstro.

[00:39:36] [SPEAKER_03]: He ultimately loses his life, altruistically saving his father's life.

[00:39:41] [SPEAKER_03]: And then he, quote, unquote, resurrects as a real boy.

[00:39:45] [SPEAKER_03]: You know, there's a deep biblical truth because most of those old Disney movies sprouted from the soil of a rich Christian worldview

[00:39:53] [SPEAKER_03]: that there is, in fact, a moral structure to reality.

[00:39:56] [SPEAKER_03]: And when you break it, reality breaks you back.

[00:39:59] [SPEAKER_03]: And that's what's being left out of the cult of self-worship, which is leaving people broken and strewn in its wake.

[00:40:08] [SPEAKER_03]: When you break the structure of moral reality, reality breaks us back.

[00:40:13] [SPEAKER_00]: Let me just mention the final chapter is love is love.

[00:40:16] [SPEAKER_00]: And, of course, thou shalt celebrate all lifestyles and love lives is equally valid.

[00:40:21] [SPEAKER_00]: I think everybody would understand that one because that has been the justification for all sorts of different sexual activity and the rest.

[00:40:29] [SPEAKER_00]: But I didn't want to leave without talking about the fact that we do have a link to jointheheretics.com.

[00:40:35] [SPEAKER_00]: First of all, people can find out about the book.

[00:40:38] [SPEAKER_00]: But you have a heretics manifesto, which is signed by all sorts of people we've had on the program,

[00:40:45] [SPEAKER_00]: including, of course, we've had Doug Groteis on yesterday.

[00:40:47] [SPEAKER_00]: He's one of the signers and many others, you and your daughter and all sorts of who's who.

[00:40:51] [SPEAKER_00]: But there's a place where as people go to jointheheretics.com, they can not only find out about the book,

[00:40:58] [SPEAKER_00]: they can be one of the signers of this heretics manifesto.

[00:41:02] [SPEAKER_00]: And so in about a minute or two, can you summarize what that is?

[00:41:06] [SPEAKER_03]: Sure.

[00:41:06] [SPEAKER_03]: There's a ton of resources on there.

[00:41:09] [SPEAKER_03]: There's supplementary articles that take the themes far deeper than the book itself.

[00:41:15] [SPEAKER_03]: I even wrote and recorded an album of original music that goes along with the book.

[00:41:22] [SPEAKER_03]: There's all kinds of interviews you can watch.

[00:41:24] [SPEAKER_03]: There's a place to sign up for a live Q&A session that I'm going to be hosting here in the near future.

[00:41:32] [SPEAKER_03]: But the Heretics Manifesto just breaks down in ten basic points.

[00:41:39] [SPEAKER_03]: Here's why the Ten Commandments of Self-Worship fail.

[00:41:42] [SPEAKER_03]: It promises an awesome life.

[00:41:44] [SPEAKER_03]: It robs us of awe.

[00:41:45] [SPEAKER_03]: It markets itself as cutting edge.

[00:41:47] [SPEAKER_03]: It's hopelessly outdated.

[00:41:49] [SPEAKER_03]: It commands us to follow our hearts, but our hearts are divided into praise.

[00:41:53] [SPEAKER_03]: And it goes through the ten.

[00:41:54] [SPEAKER_03]: But then on the flip side, it's not just a negative project.

[00:41:57] [SPEAKER_03]: It's saying, what does it mean, you know, following the wisdom of Dutch to follow God's heart?

[00:42:04] [SPEAKER_03]: And so I spell out in the manifesto, here's ten ways to be countercultural.

[00:42:09] [SPEAKER_03]: Here's ten ways to be heretics against the cult of self-worship.

[00:42:13] [SPEAKER_03]: Here's ten ways to not be a cow mooing along with the herd.

[00:42:17] [SPEAKER_03]: Have a life marked by awe for God of the Bible.

[00:42:20] [SPEAKER_03]: Reject the ancient serpent's lie to define your own reality.

[00:42:23] [SPEAKER_03]: Follow God's heart before your own, and so on.

[00:42:26] [SPEAKER_03]: So there's just a lot of resources where listeners can just go deeper and deeper.

[00:42:31] [SPEAKER_03]: There's even a way to get the audio book for those who prefer to listen to their books.

[00:42:36] [SPEAKER_03]: We have a full cast audio book with J.P. Moreland sharing J.P. Moreland stories

[00:42:41] [SPEAKER_03]: and Josh McDowell sharing Josh McDowell stories.

[00:42:45] [SPEAKER_03]: Just lost there for listeners to dive in.

[00:42:48] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, again, I appreciate you being on the program with us.

[00:42:50] [SPEAKER_00]: Again, I've appreciated both interviews we've done with you,

[00:42:53] [SPEAKER_00]: but thank you for being with us today here on Point of View.

[00:42:56] [SPEAKER_03]: Hey, it's been a joy. I look forward to next time, Kirby.

[00:42:58] [SPEAKER_00]: Again, Don't Follow Your Heart Boldly Breaking the Ten Commandments of Self-Worship,

[00:43:03] [SPEAKER_00]: published by Zondervan, written by Dr. Thaddeus Williams,

[00:43:06] [SPEAKER_00]: and you are listening to Point of View.

[00:43:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Who can you trust?

[00:43:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Years ago, many of us could probably have provided a fairly long list,

[00:43:20] [SPEAKER_01]: but today, well, today it seems we almost can't trust anyone.

[00:43:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Educators don't even know what a woman is anymore.

[00:43:29] [SPEAKER_01]: Many so-called public servants have shown all they care about is themselves.

[00:43:34] [SPEAKER_01]: The FBI has been accused of bias, law-breaking, betrayal, and journalism.

[00:43:40] [SPEAKER_01]: It's largely corrupt, with no Clark Kent standing up for truth, justice, and the American way.

[00:43:46] [SPEAKER_01]: All of this is why Point of View Radio is more important than ever,

[00:43:52] [SPEAKER_01]: and your part in supporting us is more needed than ever.

[00:43:56] [SPEAKER_01]: Do your part today in supporting trustworthy truth.

[00:44:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Stand with us and help push back the lies and the darkness.

[00:44:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Visit pointofview.net.

[00:44:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Don't put it off.

[00:44:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Take a moment right now and click on that big blue button that says Donate Now.

[00:44:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Or call to invest at 1-800-347-5151.

[00:44:20] [SPEAKER_01]: Pointofview.net and 800-347-5151.

[00:44:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Point of View will continue after this.