Point of View January 1, 2025 – Hour 1 : Tree of Life Ministries

[00:00:04] Across America, Live, this is Point of View, Kirby Anderson.

[00:00:20] Thank you for joining us and we're going to be talking about a Bible but more importantly the story about how that Bible came to be which I think is going to be a real encouragement to you and maybe a life lesson you can apply to your own life.

[00:00:32] We are joined in studio first of all with the president of Point of View, Warren Kelly and I'll explain why he is here because he is certainly an individual that I think I will give the honors of introducing our guest in studio.

[00:00:47] Ah, well thank you for that Kirby.

[00:00:49] We have with us Donya Greenberg who is the spokesperson for the Tree of Life Bible, a very unique Bible that we're going to enjoy talking about here for the next few minutes so Donya welcome.

[00:01:01] Thank you so much for having me.

[00:01:03] I'm delighted to be here, excited about talking about the TLV.

[00:01:07] I might just mention we do have a bio here and it talks about the family Bible as well and the Tree of Life version and of course also talks about your husband, Messianic Rabbi Mark Greenberg and just an incredible story but you are not the person most people would think would be behind producing a Bible.

[00:01:25] Usually that comes from Zondervan or Thomas Nelson or Tyndale.

[00:01:29] And yet here we have in front of us and I'll hold some of them up a little bit later for people to watch online a Bible and the story of how that developed is a really fascinating story.

[00:01:40] Can you share that?

[00:01:41] Thank you so much Kirby.

[00:01:42] I'd be happy to.

[00:01:42] Thank you.

[00:02:12] I became as the eldest daughter.

[00:02:14] I became, you know, kind of the second person in charge and had to do a lot of the child rearing and my life felt very heavy and complicated for just being a little kid.

[00:02:23] But as I grew and went off to college, I had this newfound freedom and of course a whole bunch of liberal ideas they were feeding me.

[00:02:30] And so in the midst of all this, I really fell hard away from God.

[00:02:35] I know that I recognized that God was real because of my Catholic upbringing, but I certainly didn't understand the sacrifice that Yeshua Jesus had made for me or had come to faith at that point.

[00:02:46] So in my college journey, as things got worse and worse, the lowest point is when I ended up in a jail cell three days before Christmas, literally a whole city away with no money and no way to get out.

[00:02:59] And I was in this holding cell and I made that same bargain most people make with God, which is God, if you get me out of here, I'll follow you forever.

[00:03:08] So I had heard the gospel message a couple of times, but I certainly hadn't received it.

[00:03:14] I actually even did Buddhism for a while.

[00:03:16] Like I did every crazy thing in college.

[00:03:18] But when I got into that jail cell and realized I had been trapped by my own sin, that I needed someone to help me.

[00:03:26] And so in praying that prayer, about three, so I got out of that situation, praise God.

[00:03:30] And about, I think maybe six months later, I moved back home and I prayed, God, send somebody to me that'll help me.

[00:03:40] I didn't know to go to church.

[00:03:41] I didn't have, what I actually had was a Bible I stole from a six-year-old kid.

[00:03:46] Not joking.

[00:03:47] What a story.

[00:03:48] It was a little Gideon Bible.

[00:03:50] Shout out to the Gideon people.

[00:03:52] There was a little Gideon Bible that I had taken from one of the families that, you know, took me in.

[00:03:59] And it said in there, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.

[00:04:04] And I remember reading that and asking God to send somebody.

[00:04:07] And two weeks later, I met this sweet little Jewish guy named Mark Greenberg.

[00:04:12] And within six weeks, remember, I wasn't walking with God.

[00:04:15] I just had made the decision to try to go in that direction.

[00:04:18] So at six weeks, we were pregnant.

[00:04:19] And three months from meeting each other, we were living together.

[00:04:23] And two months after that, we got married.

[00:04:25] And we were married 34 years.

[00:04:28] And following God together, he came to faith through Jonathan Bernis' ministry in Rochester, New York.

[00:04:34] When he heard Isaiah 53 for the first time, and Jonathan, Rabbi Jonathan said, could that be Messiah?

[00:04:41] And Mark said, yeah, I mean, I guess.

[00:04:43] And the rest is kind of history.

[00:04:45] That's an incredible story.

[00:04:47] And, of course, you have heard some of the story.

[00:04:49] I've seen her on TBN and the rest, but I'm learning some things today just sitting across the table from her.

[00:04:54] Yes, I have a little bit of extra insight.

[00:04:57] We have a unique connection.

[00:05:00] My son is Donya's daughter's husband.

[00:05:04] He's got married a few months ago.

[00:05:06] And Chris was 37 when they got married.

[00:05:09] And I was starting to wonder if he ever would get married.

[00:05:11] And now we're very, very blessed to have such a wonderful young lady as his companion, life companion.

[00:05:19] And it's been tremendous to watch that marriage get started.

[00:05:22] They're so happy together.

[00:05:23] It's the cutest thing.

[00:05:25] They're just ridiculously happy.

[00:05:27] And loving God together, it's just been a wonderful journey.

[00:05:30] Well, let's see if we can talk about this Bible.

[00:05:32] Because, of course, you and your husband for many years had all sorts of different opportunities to minister.

[00:05:38] Messianic Rabbi.

[00:05:39] You were known as the Bible lady, if I remember right.

[00:05:42] Yes, that's what they called me.

[00:05:42] And certainly the case.

[00:05:44] But somewhere along the line, this very important Bible, which we have on the table here and will show to people, actually developed.

[00:05:51] But it came from a long journey as well, didn't it?

[00:05:54] Yeah.

[00:05:55] In moving forward in Messianic ministry and my husband becoming a Messianic rabbi, as the Rebbetson, which is the word for rabbi's wife, as the Rebbetson of the congregation,

[00:06:04] I obviously was concerned about the children.

[00:06:06] And I know it's usually that people take people out of the service after praise and worship.

[00:06:13] But for us, we didn't have a big enough congregation for that.

[00:06:15] And there just weren't any resources.

[00:06:17] So I started doing this paper placemat type curriculum for children.

[00:06:22] And it ended up getting noticed enough that it went nationwide.

[00:06:27] Over 300 Messianic Jewish congregations around the country used it.

[00:06:31] And that little product called Golden Apples, I did it for three years, it was basically the study of how to go from the weekly Jewish reading in the Old Testament in the Torah, the first five books of Moses.

[00:06:42] As you travel through that week by week, I would take that scripture that my husband was teaching from in the Old Testament, and I would find a place where Jesus, Yeshua, spoke of it.

[00:06:51] And I would use that as a launching pad to a life verse.

[00:06:54] And in creating these little puzzles and diagrams and word pictures and things, it ended up really beginning to move forward the idea that if we teach our children that believing in Jesus as Jewish children is not just acceptable, it's joyous.

[00:07:09] That we could change the way that people saw Jews believing in Jesus.

[00:07:14] And I can say today that that's actually occurred.

[00:07:17] After the last 20 years or so, it was horrible to become a Jewish believer 20 years ago with me and my husband.

[00:07:23] It was a place of division for our family that was very painful.

[00:07:27] But that's not the way it is today.

[00:07:29] Today there's lots of Jewish people that believe in Yeshua.

[00:07:32] Up to 10% actually of Jewish people believe in Jesus today, where it wasn't certainly that way years ago.

[00:07:38] We're going to take a break, but one of the things I appreciate about this, Warren, and you can speak to that as well,

[00:07:43] is if you come to all this as a Gentile, you miss all sorts of things in the scripture.

[00:07:48] And that's why I'm so excited about the Tree of Life version.

[00:07:51] And so that's one of the reasons we wanted to talk about it today.

[00:07:53] Yeah, it's going to be interesting as we kind of take a look at this.

[00:07:56] It just builds in a lot of the heritage of the Jewish faith that we as Gentiles, as you mentioned, just miss out on.

[00:08:05] And it's been exciting for us as a family to getting to be a part of the Greenberg family to learn so much more about the roots of our faith.

[00:08:15] I might just mention that on the table here, and I'll try to hold them up, especially the Illustrated Heritage Bible.

[00:08:20] You have to be strong enough to hold it up.

[00:08:22] But that one, as well as the Tree of Life version, you have another version of that as well.

[00:08:26] So we actually have on the website, pointofview.net, a link to, of course, Tree of Life Ministries.

[00:08:34] Or you can simply go to tlvbiblesociety.org.

[00:08:39] But you can just find it on the website.

[00:08:41] We'll come back and continue our conversation right after this.

[00:08:58] This is Viewpoints with Kirby Anderson.

[00:09:02] Let me begin by wishing you a Happy New Year.

[00:09:05] At the start of this new year, I wanted to pass on some advice.

[00:09:08] In previous commentaries, I've talked about the value of using this time of year to change something in your life.

[00:09:13] There's nothing magical about using January 1st as a start date, but why not use it to improve yourself?

[00:09:18] First, I would encourage you to pick just one thing to change.

[00:09:22] If you try to change too many things at once, you're probably not going to succeed.

[00:09:26] And I would also recommend that you make it specific and concrete and that you write it down.

[00:09:31] The more specific you are, the greater likelihood you will be successful.

[00:09:35] Second, aim low.

[00:09:36] In previous New Year's commentaries, I've quoted from Tristan Taylor, who encourages people to strive for mediocrity.

[00:09:42] Don't pick something that's too big to achieve.

[00:09:45] Start small.

[00:09:45] After all, you are where you are right now due to dozens of small changes or compromises you made in the past.

[00:09:51] I realize that motivational speakers challenge us to strive for excellence.

[00:09:55] First, we should pick a goal that challenges us, but also pick a reasonable goal so that you can see and enjoy some level of success.

[00:10:02] Short-term success can lead to greater success.

[00:10:05] Third, expect difficulties.

[00:10:06] It seems like the moment you start a diet, people around you start inviting you to banquets and all-you-can-eat buffets.

[00:10:12] The day after you join a fitness club, your life gets busy and you cannot find time to get to the gym.

[00:10:17] The moment you decide to do a daily quiet time, your boss asks you to come in early for work.

[00:10:21] Fourth, accept failure.

[00:10:23] You might find that for every two steps forward, you take one step back.

[00:10:27] Sometimes you even take two steps back.

[00:10:29] This is where dedication and perseverance come into play.

[00:10:32] Finally, plan a reward.

[00:10:34] This gives you a goal to achieve and a reward for your dedication.

[00:10:37] This is the first day of the year, so go for it.

[00:10:40] I'm Kirby Anderson, and that's my point of view.

[00:10:47] Go deeper on topics like you just heard by visiting pointofview.net.

[00:10:53] That's pointofview.net.

[00:10:57] You're listening to Point of View, your listener-supported source for truth.

[00:11:03] Back once again, we're going to be talking about the Tree of Life Version Bible.

[00:11:06] And again, we have in studio with us Donya Greenberg, as well as, of course,

[00:11:11] our individual that is the president of Point of View, because we're in Kelley.

[00:11:16] We really want to get into the Bible, but we really need to tell that story as well, don't we?

[00:11:21] Yeah.

[00:11:22] It would be interesting to know a little bit about that.

[00:11:25] I'm thinking back in the 60s when we were all kids and the Earth's crust hadn't quite hardened,

[00:11:30] that everybody had a King James Bible.

[00:11:33] And over the years, there was the Living Bible and the New King James and a few others that came out.

[00:11:37] And there's been kind of a proliferation of Bibles coming out, different versions.

[00:11:42] What led you to create the Tree of Life Bible?

[00:11:45] Well, when I was doing the children's curriculum,

[00:11:49] I would use scriptures from what we used then in that early part of the movement.

[00:11:53] Right after the Jesus movement, there was a lot of Jewish people that got saved, a lot.

[00:11:57] Wow.

[00:11:58] And now they've become PhDs.

[00:11:59] But at that time, there was a certain individual, a wonderful man by the name of David Stern,

[00:12:05] who did something called the Complete Jewish Bible, which I'm sure you're familiar with.

[00:12:08] And by the way, all of these Bibles we're talking about, they're all on YouVersion.

[00:12:11] You can even find our Bible on the TLV Bible app.

[00:12:14] But the Complete Jewish Bible was the only Bible available back when my children were growing up.

[00:12:18] And so I got a Complete Jewish Bible for my son, who was turning 12 at his bar mitzvah, he was 13,

[00:12:23] and he wanted to start reading the Bible.

[00:12:25] He couldn't get through Genesis because there was so much Hebrew terminology.

[00:12:30] And the reading level of that Bible was like 11th or 12th grade level, which is way above standard.

[00:12:37] And then beyond that, it was not helpful because he really wanted to learn the Bible.

[00:12:44] And the golden apples lessons would have a scripture from it, but it was just outside his reading.

[00:12:49] So I wanted to do a children's Bible, a Messianic children's Bible,

[00:12:52] because our kids were reading Jesus in their Bibles, but they were hearing Dad say Yeshua, his Hebrew name, from the pulpit.

[00:13:02] So I didn't want to cause a division in their thinking.

[00:13:04] So I set out to start a children's Bible project.

[00:13:07] And because I was a sweet little rabbi's wife and I wasn't one of the theologians,

[00:13:11] nobody really took me seriously at first.

[00:13:13] But I went to 12 different organizations, one at a time,

[00:13:16] and I said, would you give me a theologian, a $5,000 gift, and be on our board of directors?

[00:13:22] And God gave us a way to bring all the different denominations of Messianic Judaism together

[00:13:26] to create a vetted version of the scriptures called the Tree of Life Version.

[00:13:31] One of the things you have right here, I guess I can hold up one of those here,

[00:13:34] which if you're watching online can be.

[00:13:37] But then, of course, Warren has one, the Illustrated Bible,

[00:13:40] which again is much heavier,

[00:13:41] but it just is an illustration of some of you might want to have something like this.

[00:13:46] And, of course, we've got a link to a Tree of Life Version.

[00:13:49] But again, you were able to find a way to finance this.

[00:13:54] And we're not talking about going to a major publisher that says,

[00:13:57] oh, yeah, we'll allocate like a million dollars to this particular version of the Bible.

[00:14:01] It was all a project which was really grassroots, wasn't it?

[00:14:04] Yeah, it was.

[00:14:05] Everybody started giving toward it.

[00:14:06] And we started believing that we could get a Bible done.

[00:14:09] Now, I never thought we'd do a translation.

[00:14:11] That was far beyond what I believed would happen.

[00:14:14] But God just started this miracle in motion.

[00:14:16] And people started giving.

[00:14:18] And churches started getting behind it.

[00:14:20] And we got the New Testament done.

[00:14:22] And then I went, I was asking God, you know,

[00:14:24] and everybody kept asking me,

[00:14:26] Donya, when's the Bible going to be done?

[00:14:27] Donya, when's the Bible going to be done?

[00:14:28] Well, we had 300 congregations in the whole nation of less than 100 people each,

[00:14:33] less than 50, most of them.

[00:14:34] We didn't have that kind of finances.

[00:14:36] Messianic Jewish organizations, believe it or not,

[00:14:38] they received less than 0.4 of 1% of tithes and offerings given among believers in America.

[00:14:44] It's so small the way that they're supported because people don't really know we exist.

[00:14:49] But we had such a hunger to create a Bible for our children that people started to give.

[00:14:54] And so when we got the New Testament done and everybody wanted the old one done,

[00:14:58] I realized I needed help.

[00:15:00] So I went and asked Pastor Jack Hayford if he would help me.

[00:15:04] And Pastor Jack turned a five or 10-minute meeting with me into two and a half hours.

[00:15:09] And with the help of Gateway Church here in Dallas and Pastor Robert Morris,

[00:15:14] they agreed to give a quarter of a million dollar grant to help us finish the Old Testament.

[00:15:19] So all together, it was about $5 million we raised over these years through moving TLB products

[00:15:26] and getting people to know about the Bible.

[00:15:28] Well, and I remember, I think I watched on TBN that Robert Morris said,

[00:15:32] why wouldn't we want to give to that, you know?

[00:15:34] And so again, that just is an incredible success story.

[00:15:38] And I wanted people to hear that because even before we get into the Bible, Warren,

[00:15:41] this is a story that people need to know.

[00:15:43] Sometimes people say, I don't have the resources.

[00:15:46] What can just one person do or what can a few of us do?

[00:15:49] And the bottom line is this force of nature over here across from us

[00:15:54] is able to show us that you can do quite a bit.

[00:15:56] You can.

[00:15:57] And I mean, that's even kind of the heritage and point of view.

[00:15:59] I remember Marlon Maddox, our founder, talked about being upset as he watched the news every night

[00:16:04] about what was happening and looking at how people were not applying biblical truths

[00:16:08] to every part of their lives.

[00:16:10] He talked about, you know, they go to church on Sunday

[00:16:13] and then Monday they put their shelf, their biblical truth or their Christianity back up on the shelf

[00:16:18] and leave it there for the week.

[00:16:19] And then Sunday morning they'll pull it back down to bring back out.

[00:16:22] And he kept saying, God, you need to have somebody do something about this.

[00:16:26] You need to have somebody say something.

[00:16:27] And finally he realized, you know, God, maybe you're telling me.

[00:16:30] And, you know, 50 years later, we're still here building on that legacy.

[00:16:35] Yeah.

[00:16:36] 51 years, I think there's a future for it.

[00:16:38] So we'll keep doing that as long as we can.

[00:16:40] Well, America needs you, man.

[00:16:41] You better.

[00:16:41] Yeah.

[00:16:43] So, Donya, talk about for just a minute some of the facts and figures here

[00:16:46] because when we come to Bibles, we really haven't talked about that very much.

[00:16:49] But you've pulled together some material that I think we need to hear.

[00:16:52] Yeah, I think that it's wonderful to, first of all, recognize how deeply the Bible is loved in America.

[00:16:58] The latest information that I was studying earlier today said that from the 2023 State of the Bible poll

[00:17:06] that 24% of adult Americans read their Bible one time a week outside church.

[00:17:11] Now, that may not impress y'all, but, man, it impressed me.

[00:17:14] I'm glad to know that one out of every four people in America is still opening their Bible.

[00:17:18] Now, the question is, are they understanding what they're reading?

[00:17:21] And are they enjoying spending time in their Bible?

[00:17:25] So, I know that as for me and my house, we're going to serve the Lord.

[00:17:28] So, we started this Bible project by finding an artist that would create images of Jesus, of Yeshua, that were more Jewish.

[00:17:38] And I know that that doesn't seem like a big deal to you guys,

[00:17:42] because I grew up with a children's Bible where Jesus was blonde-haired and blue-eyed.

[00:17:47] I know.

[00:17:47] I know that's why we saw him that way, because realize how you see Yeshua as a kid is how you're going to see him as an adult.

[00:17:52] So, not only his name had to be Yeshua for my little Jewish kids, but they had to see him as a Jewish man.

[00:17:59] So, I commissioned this artist, and he did 101 unique illustrations,

[00:18:03] the very first collection of illustrations by a Jewish believer in Jesus of the Bible from Genesis to Revelation ever.

[00:18:11] Wow.

[00:18:12] This is the first text of a Bible that has been created by Jewish believers in Jesus

[00:18:17] and their Christian brothers side-by-side creating this text.

[00:18:22] That's the thing that makes it exciting, is we've brought it back to the Jewish Bible order in the Old Testament.

[00:18:28] There's a really great reason for that.

[00:18:29] But we also included and peppered it with Hebrew transliterated words that would give you a deeper meaning.

[00:18:35] Yeah.

[00:18:36] I want to just take a minute, if I can,

[00:18:38] and I'd take a couple of familiar passages that our listeners are going to know,

[00:18:42] but read them from your version so they can see kind of the difference.

[00:18:45] And in Genesis 1-1, it says,

[00:18:47] In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

[00:18:49] Now, the earth was chaos and waste.

[00:18:52] Darkness was on the surface of the deep,

[00:18:54] and the Ruach Elohim was hovering over the surface of the water.

[00:18:58] It's a little different than what my King James Bible looked like.

[00:19:01] Well, I love the Ruach Elohim.

[00:19:03] The Ruach is the Spirit.

[00:19:05] Elohim is God.

[00:19:06] So the Spirit of God was hovering over the water.

[00:19:09] And that harkens back to what Yeshua said about a hen gathers her chicks.

[00:19:13] Oh, Jerusalem, Jerusalem.

[00:19:15] That the idea that the Holy Spirit, who hovered over Mary and created, right?

[00:19:20] The Lord uses his, he sends his Spirit into the world.

[00:19:24] The Spirit of God is the fuel of creation.

[00:19:27] It's the verb of God moving on the earth.

[00:19:30] And to show that to people by using Ruach Elohim means that the Ruach also means, in Hebrew, the breath of God.

[00:19:37] So every time you breathe, you're saying God's name.

[00:19:40] You're inhaling on the, ah, and you're exhaling on the, ah.

[00:19:45] You're actually, it says everything that has breath praises the Lord.

[00:19:48] It's actually true.

[00:19:49] Wow.

[00:19:50] Well, looking at a verse out of Matthew, chapter 1, verse 18 says,

[00:19:54] Now the birth of Yeshua, the Messiah, happened this way when his mother Miriam was engaged to Joseph.

[00:20:00] But before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Ruach.

[00:20:04] And I'm going to let you say it because I'm going to say it wrong.

[00:20:07] Okay.

[00:20:08] What does it say?

[00:20:09] What does it say right there?

[00:20:10] There.

[00:20:10] It says.

[00:20:11] The Hebrew, I'm going to mispronounce it.

[00:20:13] Oh, it's beautiful.

[00:20:14] It says Ruach HaKodesh.

[00:20:16] Ruach is breath.

[00:20:18] HaKodesh is the holy.

[00:20:19] So it means the holy breath of God.

[00:20:22] But notice that it's not Mary, as we're used to seeing, but Miriam.

[00:20:26] It's Miriam.

[00:20:27] So why is that?

[00:20:28] Well, we chose to only change four names in the whole Bible.

[00:20:33] We could have done what the Complete Jewish Bible did, which is change every single name and every single location to the Hebraic terminology.

[00:20:39] But we felt like that would be overreaching, what would actually help people.

[00:20:43] So the reason that we wanted to use Miriam, we changed four names.

[00:20:48] Miriam, Yeshua, Yaakov, and Yehudah, Judah.

[00:20:52] So Jacob and Jude.

[00:20:54] You know that the last to second to last.

[00:20:57] Go ahead.

[00:20:57] You understand.

[00:20:58] We need to take a break.

[00:20:59] And we're going to come back and give you a chance to finish that comment.

[00:21:02] But we have one of those mandatory breaks.

[00:21:04] And Warren knows all about that.

[00:21:05] So we'll come back and talk about the rest of that because I think you've got one other verse here.

[00:21:09] So if you find this interesting, you might go to the website pointofview.net.

[00:21:13] And when you go there, you'll find a link to the Tree of Life version.

[00:21:17] And, of course, we have all sorts of information about that on the website.

[00:21:21] Let's take a break.

[00:21:22] We'll continue our conversation right after this.

[00:21:30] The Bible tells us not to worry.

[00:21:33] And yet there is a lot of worrying stuff in our world today.

[00:21:38] Thankfully, the Bible doesn't stop at telling us not to worry.

[00:21:43] God gives us a next step.

[00:21:45] He says we need to pray.

[00:21:47] But sometimes even knowing what to pray can be difficult.

[00:21:52] And that is why Point of View has relaunched our Pray for America movement,

[00:21:57] a series of weekly emails to guide you in prayer for our nation.

[00:22:02] Each week, you'll receive a brief update about a current issue affecting Americans,

[00:22:08] along with a written prayer that you can easily share with others.

[00:22:13] We'll also include a short free resource for you in each email

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[00:22:47] Point of View will continue after this.

[00:22:56] You are listening to Point of View.

[00:23:01] The opinions expressed on Point of View do not necessarily reflect the views of the management or staff of this station.

[00:23:09] And now, here again, is Kirby Anderson.

[00:23:13] Back once again in studio, Donya Greenberg as well as Warren Kelly.

[00:23:16] And we have a link to, again, TLVBibleSociety.org.

[00:23:22] First of all, you can find out more about this Tree of Life version.

[00:23:26] There is a way in which you can get the TLV Bible app.

[00:23:30] There is a coloring Bible there as well.

[00:23:32] There is a really very good video that goes on for more than 20 minutes,

[00:23:38] which I think gives you a great explanation.

[00:23:40] So there is certainly a lot to cover.

[00:23:42] It's all at our website, pointofview.net.

[00:23:44] But Warren, just a minute ago, you were reading a passage, obviously, from the New Testament.

[00:23:48] Yes.

[00:23:49] And then we said, wait a minute, it's Miriam, not Mary.

[00:23:52] And, Donya, you were talking about the fact that you felt the need to change at least a few of those names.

[00:23:57] Explain that.

[00:23:58] Yeah, I feel like the most important thing was, obviously, if you change the name of Jesus to Yeshua,

[00:24:04] you want to make sure that people understand that his mom was Miriam, not Mary, right?

[00:24:08] And then I found out something really exciting.

[00:24:10] And that was that the books of Jude and James, right, the two books before Revelation,

[00:24:17] those two books were by Yeshua's half-brothers, Jesus' half-brothers.

[00:24:21] I went for 20 years not knowing that.

[00:24:23] Wow.

[00:24:24] So when we started to do this Bible project, and I was like, wait a second.

[00:24:27] If those are his family, then we should call him Jacob and Jude so that they know it's family.

[00:24:33] And the reason I think that's so important for your viewers and for people who are listening

[00:24:37] is because after the resurrection of Messiah, when it became known that he was the Son of God,

[00:24:43] that Son of God wasn't just his label as the Messiah,

[00:24:46] but was actually the truth that he was God incarnate come to earth,

[00:24:50] that that revelation was so moving that his own brothers who rejected him came to faith enough

[00:24:57] so that they wrote two books of the Bible.

[00:25:00] If you can believe God for your family's salvation, isn't that a great place to start?

[00:25:05] I don't like when people say that you're not there to lead your family.

[00:25:09] Absolutely, you're the best witness for your family.

[00:25:12] But take a minute and explain, because Jacob is the book of James.

[00:25:16] It's what we've all heard.

[00:25:18] But you have it labeled as the book of Jacob, which was his actual name.

[00:25:22] So how did you get from Jacob to James?

[00:25:24] Well, it's the King James Bible, folks.

[00:25:27] Does it need more explanation than that?

[00:25:29] They wanted to make sure that he was represented.

[00:25:33] So I think that's what happened.

[00:25:34] And also, I think the reason they went to Jude is because, remember,

[00:25:38] there's three different characters in the Bible named Jude.

[00:25:40] There's Judah of the 12 tribes, and then there's Judas.

[00:25:45] Do you know that Judah of Creote is Judah of the place of Creote?

[00:25:51] Judas Iscariot is like a first and last name, like Jesus Christ is a first and last name,

[00:25:56] when Christ actually means Messiah.

[00:25:58] So some of the things that you're going to figure out with the TLV

[00:26:01] is the difference between nomenclature that's used for clarity

[00:26:05] versus what the actual text says.

[00:26:08] And so I think that that's super helpful.

[00:26:10] Very interesting.

[00:26:12] Again, you're probably learning all sorts of things,

[00:26:13] which is why, again, we want to talk about the Bible.

[00:26:16] But as you open up the Bible, you're going to see the names have changed.

[00:26:19] You're also going to see that the order of the books have changed.

[00:26:22] Can you explain that?

[00:26:23] Oh, it's so exciting.

[00:26:24] Again, another revelation that came halfway through the project.

[00:26:27] So fun for me.

[00:26:28] So I was at this meeting with these Rebitsons, other rabbis' wives,

[00:26:32] and one of them who had grown up Orthodox said to me,

[00:26:34] well, you have to make sure you return the Bible to the right order.

[00:26:36] And I'm like, what are you talking about?

[00:26:38] She said, well, the order is different in a Jewish Bible.

[00:26:40] Now, of course, we're only talking about the Old Testament

[00:26:42] because Jewish Bibles don't include the New Testament, right?

[00:26:45] But did you know that the Jewish order of the books in the Old Testament

[00:26:49] is given in categories?

[00:26:51] It's not given the way it is in Christian Bibles.

[00:26:53] So the best way to describe that is this.

[00:26:55] There's the Torah, which is the first five books of the Bible

[00:27:00] that are the books of Moses.

[00:27:01] Then the next section in a Jewish Bible is called the Nevi'im.

[00:27:05] That's the prophets.

[00:27:06] And then the third section is the Ketuvim.

[00:27:08] That's the writings.

[00:27:10] So in Christian Bibles, the Nevi'im and Ketuvim are woven together like a tapestry,

[00:27:15] whereas in a Jewish Bible, they're kept separate on purpose.

[00:27:19] So there's two really great reasons why this is important.

[00:27:21] First of all, when you end the Jewish Bible,

[00:27:25] the end of the Jewish Bible is talking about how the proclamation of Cyrus of Persia,

[00:27:31] when he says to bring back, it says,

[00:27:33] Thus the king Cyrus of Persia says,

[00:27:36] Adonai, the God of heaven, has given me all the kingdoms of the earth.

[00:27:39] He has appointed me to build him a house in Jerusalem, which is in Judah.

[00:27:43] Whoever among you of all his people may go up and may Adonai his God be with him.

[00:27:48] That's an inclusive, loving God that makes the God of Israel available to all people.

[00:27:54] Whereas if you go to the Christian order of the books, it ends in Malachi.

[00:27:59] And let me tell you why this is not a place to end if you want to turn the next page

[00:28:03] and see Matthew if you're Jewish.

[00:28:06] Think about this for a minute.

[00:28:07] Behold, end of Malachi,

[00:28:09] Behold, I'm going to send you Elijah, the prophet,

[00:28:12] before the coming of the great and terrible day of Adonai, which means the Lord.

[00:28:15] He will turn the hearts of fathers to the children, the hearts of children to the fathers.

[00:28:20] But listen to what it says.

[00:28:22] Else I will come and strike the land with utter destruction.

[00:28:26] So when a Bible is written in the Christian canon, in the Christian order,

[00:28:30] you leave the Jews at utter destruction before they accept Jesus and the new covenant.

[00:28:35] That's so much more harsh and unforgiving than ending in 2 Chronicles.

[00:28:39] So our goal at the beginning with the TLV was to make a Bible that was for Jewish people to come to faith.

[00:28:46] But the crazy thing that's happened is it is reaching Christians worldwide with the good news that he died for all of us.

[00:28:54] And salvation isn't just for Christians.

[00:28:56] It's for Jews.

[00:28:57] It's for everyone.

[00:28:58] The Bible is for everyone.

[00:28:59] There's another illustration there because remember when Jesus refers to the law and the prophets,

[00:29:05] well, those come together.

[00:29:06] Exactly.

[00:29:07] Go ahead.

[00:29:07] Bill, it was great.

[00:29:08] Say it.

[00:29:09] And again, that's important because the law and then the prophets and then the rest.

[00:29:13] And of course, when we see it, the law, you jump over everything from 1 and 2 Chronicles,

[00:29:19] 1 and 2 Kings, Psalms, Proverbs and everything to get to the Proverbs.

[00:29:23] And then eventually to the prophets.

[00:29:25] You go, wait a minute.

[00:29:26] That doesn't fit very well.

[00:29:27] But of course, you can see why Jesus talked about the law and the prophets.

[00:29:30] Yeah, because that was what people were reading.

[00:29:32] Right after in the years of silence between what we call the Older Testament and the Newer Testament.

[00:29:38] Right.

[00:29:38] So now another fun thing to think about, and this I hope will really galvanize people who are listening to find this out for themselves in the Bible.

[00:29:46] The most amazing thing about the prophets and the writings being separate categorically is that prophets get a word from God.

[00:29:55] Think of that as a vertical word, right?

[00:29:57] It comes from God to heaven.

[00:29:59] But history travels like on the x-axis.

[00:30:02] So if you think about it, you're given a word from God, but you're not given it in the time in history where you could refute it.

[00:30:09] A word from God comes at a different time so that when the timing comes true, you know it's a prophecy.

[00:30:16] So every divine intersection between the prophets and the writings points to Yeshua.

[00:30:22] That's very good.

[00:30:24] Well, one other issue I thought I'd put on the table, and of course, jump in anytime you want, Warren.

[00:30:28] But another one is the fact that because of the Jewish Bible and because of what you put together, some of that makes some sense.

[00:30:36] Because you connect Old Testament to New Testament.

[00:30:39] And lots of times as Gentiles, when Jesus says, I'm the light of the world, or a variety of other statements,

[00:30:46] or when he says the gates of hell will not prevail against it, you have to either know the chronology,

[00:30:53] that is what particular feast was taking place at that time,

[00:30:57] or you have to know the geography because you have to recognize that when he said the gates of hell,

[00:31:03] he said that in Caesarea Philippi.

[00:31:05] And so there is a sense in which, again, if you don't have that background,

[00:31:09] you miss the significance of what Jesus teaches, right?

[00:31:12] I agree with that.

[00:31:13] And I just want to encourage you that the Bible is really a timepiece.

[00:31:16] It's an almanac.

[00:31:17] It shows you how to grow, how to grow your children, how to grow your family, how to grow your relationship with God.

[00:31:24] And the best way to think about your relationship with God is going back to the garden.

[00:31:29] When God gives wisdom, which comes from above, and our understanding is built as we grow,

[00:31:35] then between wisdom and understanding is the word knowledge.

[00:31:39] But knowledge, of course, has two sides, good and evil.

[00:31:42] But good always overcomes evil.

[00:31:45] The light always outshines the darkness.

[00:31:48] The darkness doesn't even know it.

[00:31:50] So as you begin to see God use the Bible as an almanac,

[00:31:54] you'll recognize things like what is a new moon,

[00:31:57] and why is it that Passover happens on the full moon?

[00:32:00] Because Yeshua died on Passover and rose at the beginning of the journey toward first fruits.

[00:32:08] He was the first fruit of the risen.

[00:32:09] The Holy Spirit is poured out on the Feast of Weeks, right?

[00:32:13] The trumpet is sounded upon his return.

[00:32:16] The Feast of Tabernacles is what's alluded to in Zechariah 12.

[00:32:21] All of these holidays punctuate year after year the coming of our Lord and Savior.

[00:32:26] We're going to take a break, but when we come back,

[00:32:28] I do want to encourage all of you to go to TLVBibleSociety.org

[00:32:33] because I want to talk about the Bible app.

[00:32:36] You also have, of course, Children's Bibles and a number of other resources.

[00:32:40] And again, you can watch that video a little bit later

[00:32:42] because that will be taking you more than just a few minutes during the break.

[00:32:45] But you're going to find all sorts of other resources.

[00:32:48] And I do want to talk about, Don, just before we finish the program today,

[00:32:52] talk about everything that's available on that website.

[00:32:54] But again, it's Tree of Life Bible Society, and you can find out more about that.

[00:32:58] And Warren, we're learning all sorts of things today, aren't we?

[00:33:01] We are, and it's been a fascinating journey as our families have become connected,

[00:33:06] and I've been looking at the Bible, and there's some helps that are built into the Bible

[00:33:09] to help understand some of these things.

[00:33:11] Because there is just so much of the Bible that is built around the Jewish culture

[00:33:16] that we as Gentiles don't understand, and we just miss a lot of that.

[00:33:19] I think many of you, if you've never been to a Passover Seder or something like that,

[00:33:24] you might begin to do that just to, again, understand the significance of everything

[00:33:29] that you've been reading in your Bible for many years.

[00:33:31] So if you think you've learned everything that the Bible has to teach,

[00:33:35] I think there's some other things all of us can learn,

[00:33:37] and that's why we're around the table today learning more.

[00:33:40] We'll take a break.

[00:33:41] We'll be back right after this.

[00:33:55] You're listening to Point of View, your listener-supported source for truth.

[00:34:00] Back once again, let me just mention a couple of resources

[00:34:03] and actually Internet sites that we might point you to.

[00:34:06] One is Donya Greenberg, and it's d-a-n-i-a-h greenberg.com.

[00:34:12] And if you would like to maybe have her come and speak,

[00:34:14] or if you would like to follow her blog,

[00:34:16] or maybe see some of the other interviews she's done,

[00:34:19] or those kinds of things, that is available up there.

[00:34:21] But also, in addition to her website, is, of course, tlvbiblesociety.org.

[00:34:28] Donya, let's see if we can talk about the fact that one of the first things you see

[00:34:32] when you come to that website is the TLV Bible app.

[00:34:36] And you have that on your phone right now.

[00:34:37] Thank you so much.

[00:34:38] The TLV Bible app is a phenomenal resource because it includes,

[00:34:43] obviously, we give away the entire Bible for free on there.

[00:34:46] So just go to your Apple Store, Google Play, and get the TLV Bible app.

[00:34:51] On the Bible app, you can read the entire Bible.

[00:34:53] It has search functions and lots of ways to enjoy your Bible.

[00:34:57] It has an audio Bible, which will help you with the Hebrew terminology.

[00:35:00] And it also includes a lot of videos about how to celebrate holidays

[00:35:04] and how to use your Bible as an almanac.

[00:35:06] Plus, there's art collections on there and children's hands-out and printables.

[00:35:11] But the most important feature for me is the good old calendar

[00:35:14] because I love watching the calendar.

[00:35:17] And when you watch the calendar, you can actually find out when Passover is coming,

[00:35:20] when the biblical feasts are coming, and then we give you information about how to celebrate them.

[00:35:24] And this particular Passover is just less than about two weeks away now.

[00:35:29] And if you're planning on celebrating Passover and you'd like a one-sheet handout that we did

[00:35:33] with the Jewish blessings on it so you can eat lamb and bitter herbs and matzah

[00:35:37] and celebrate the Exodus, you can just download it right off your app.

[00:35:41] So go ahead and get the TLV Bible app.

[00:35:43] And last but not least, I do a daily proverb on there

[00:35:46] because that's, believe it or not, one of the things people really want to know

[00:35:49] is wisdom for decision-making, biblical wisdom for decision-making.

[00:35:53] It's interesting that the Bible was written by Jewish people.

[00:35:58] It was written from a Jewish culture.

[00:36:00] And there is so much of the culture that we as Gentiles just don't understand.

[00:36:05] And we miss a lot of the meaning of what's said there.

[00:36:08] I mean, in one of the breaks a moment ago, you mentioned that the eclipse happened on a Jewish holiday.

[00:36:13] And I wonder how, I did not know that.

[00:36:16] I wonder how many of the people in our listening audience knew and what holiday was it?

[00:36:20] Yeah, it's what's called Rosh Kodesh, which is the new moon.

[00:36:25] So in Judaism, you're supposed to celebrate every new moon.

[00:36:29] And at a new moon, there's no moon in the sky because that mimics what happened with Abraham.

[00:36:35] Abraham looked up at the sky.

[00:36:36] There was no moon.

[00:36:37] It was all stars.

[00:36:37] And God promised him offspring and a land.

[00:36:40] So you remember that promise by looking at the stars in the sky before the moon waxes and wanes,

[00:36:47] which is a monthly cycle.

[00:36:48] And that's one of the ways that you enjoy your walk with the Lord is to recognize that there's a weekly cycle,

[00:36:55] six days secular, one day holy.

[00:36:57] There's a monthly cycle, 14 days waxing and 14 days waning.

[00:37:01] And that full moon is when Passover is.

[00:37:04] That's why it's interesting to me that the new moon before Passover this year is about when that eclipse happened.

[00:37:10] Very interesting.

[00:37:11] Very interesting.

[00:37:11] And again, we've talked about the importance of rhythm because that's what was intended.

[00:37:15] You go back to, you just read from Genesis a few minutes ago.

[00:37:18] I mean, six days and a day of rest.

[00:37:21] And then, of course, you had six years and then a seventh year of rest.

[00:37:26] And then seven sevens and 49 year of Jubilee.

[00:37:30] All sorts of things.

[00:37:31] And today, because you have a 24-7 lifestyle, we've missed a lot of that, which is one of the reasons why I'm so big about Christian camping.

[00:37:39] Because when you get people out in God's creation and you can mix God's revelation in nature with God's revelation in his word, some things really happen.

[00:37:49] And I think we and it brings us back to those rhythms, which were essential in the nation of Israel and I think are still essential to us today.

[00:37:56] What are your thoughts?

[00:37:57] Absolutely.

[00:37:58] I think timing, there's a wonderful phrase that people like to use when they talk about the end times.

[00:38:02] And it came from Daniel.

[00:38:04] Time, times, and half a time.

[00:38:07] When you read it just in context, you don't recognize that time began in the garden.

[00:38:12] Times are seed time and harvest time.

[00:38:15] And then you go to time, times, and half a time.

[00:38:19] Your half a time is the waxing and waning.

[00:38:21] And it's also the seed time and the six months that are harvest.

[00:38:26] Everything in the Bible reduces down to binary because God's the only one who's one.

[00:38:33] Everything else in creation is two.

[00:38:35] I think our listeners are learning some things that they haven't heard before.

[00:38:39] Well, I just wanted to, again, expose you to that and recognize, as I said just a minute ago, and I'd love to have you maybe, Donya, talk about this.

[00:38:46] It would be good for everybody to go through at least one Seder because you actually understand a little bit more of what Jesus was teaching and why that happened and how that all came together.

[00:38:58] So is there a way in which sometimes people can find their local Messianic Jewish congregation where somebody could come in and do that for them and their church?

[00:39:07] Absolutely.

[00:39:07] But let me give you the bare bones how to celebrate Passover at home.

[00:39:11] This is so good.

[00:39:12] I want you to go to Exodus 6-6 because that is the founding scripture of why we celebrate Passover Seder.

[00:39:18] Seder means order.

[00:39:19] Passover is obviously a biblical holiday.

[00:39:22] If you go to Exodus 6-6, it says it right in this wonderful scripture, how to do your own Seder.

[00:39:29] Let me see if I can get to it real quick.

[00:39:30] It says right here in verse 6,

[00:39:33] Therefore say to B'nai Israel, that's the children of Israel, I am Adonai, that's the word Lord, and I will bring you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians.

[00:39:41] I will deliver you from their bondage.

[00:39:43] I will redeem you with an outstretched arm and with great judgments.

[00:39:46] I will take you to myself as a people, and I will be your God.

[00:39:49] Okay, folks, a Passover Seder is made up with the three things you have to eat that day.

[00:39:54] Passover lamb, some type of lamb, get it at your takeout if you want to.

[00:39:58] Matzah, which you can get at any local grocery store.

[00:40:01] And then you need to eat bitter herbs.

[00:40:03] So get anything from watercress to horseradish, whatever makes you happy.

[00:40:07] But what it comes down to is those four cups.

[00:40:10] And the cups represent, it represents those four words, bring you out is sanctification.

[00:40:15] Deliver you is the cup of salvation.

[00:40:18] Deliver you is the cup that starts after dinner that Yeshua used to say it's my body and my blood.

[00:40:24] And then I will take you to myself.

[00:40:26] That's the cup of the kingdom.

[00:40:27] We do four toasts to God, two before the meal and two after, because we're following the journey of Israel to become free from bondage.

[00:40:36] All of us fall into bondage.

[00:40:38] All of us fall into places where we don't feel free.

[00:40:40] We need to find freedom this Passover.

[00:40:42] And the final cup, the kingdom.

[00:40:44] Amen.

[00:40:44] And heading towards.

[00:40:46] So Warren, if nothing else, pretty good.

[00:40:48] It is.

[00:40:49] We can learn.

[00:40:50] And I think, Donya, that probably a lot of the people in our audience are like me that don't realize that the Jewish people still celebrate these festivals.

[00:40:58] They still have the ceremonies and the symbolism that are part of the culture.

[00:41:03] Even on the, talk about the beginning of Sabbath.

[00:41:07] Yeah, the Friday night Sabbath or whatever day, whatever is the evening before the day that you celebrate the Lord.

[00:41:13] It can be Saturday night for you.

[00:41:14] It can be Friday night for me.

[00:41:15] We still follow the same God.

[00:41:17] But there's a point where you set aside your day and you end your day.

[00:41:22] And at the end of the day is actually the beginning of the day, which is at sundown.

[00:41:26] So every Friday night, me and my family and all our little babies around the table, we bless the wine and the challah bread.

[00:41:34] We cover the challah bread with a beautiful napkin or our challah cover because we want the dew that covers the double portion of manna.

[00:41:41] We bless the wine because it symbolizes the fullness of God and having a full cup of salvation.

[00:41:47] And every week we do this with our children and they get excited about it because it becomes part of their culture.

[00:41:54] It's not just culture for Jewish people.

[00:41:56] It's culture for all followers of Messiah.

[00:41:58] But all of these things have a symbolism that tie back to the scriptures that are things that we just missed.

[00:42:05] And some of that you can pick up by getting the Bible app, the TLV app or one of the Bibles of the website.

[00:42:12] And again, it's TLVBibleSociety.org or you can go to PointofView.net and we have a link to it from there.

[00:42:17] Donya, thank you so very much for coming in today.

[00:42:20] I'm so honored.

[00:42:20] Thank you for having me.

[00:42:21] It has been fun to watch you on, of course, Trinity Broadcasting and also to meet you face to face.

[00:42:26] It's great to have you in studio.

[00:42:27] One last time, as Warren mentioned, we do have a link to TLVBibleSociety.org.

[00:42:33] And, of course, DonyaGreenberg.com.

[00:42:36] Both of those are on the website.

[00:42:37] And if you'd like to have her come and speak or maybe educate you or if you'd like to learn a little bit more about these Bibles,

[00:42:43] they are all on our website at PointofView.net.

[00:42:46] But let's take a break.

[00:42:47] When we come back, we're going to change topics, although we could certainly have gone another hour.

[00:42:51] But I think we've covered enough there.

[00:42:53] And, Warren, as busy as you are, thank you for coming in.

[00:42:56] It's been my pleasure.

[00:42:57] We're going to take a break.

[00:42:58] We have a lot more to cover right here on Point of View.

[00:43:00] We'll see you back in just a few minutes right after these messages.

[00:43:03] It almost seems like we live in a different world from many people in positions of authority.

[00:43:16] They say men can be women and women men.

[00:43:19] People are prosecuted differently or not at all depending on their politics.

[00:43:24] Criminals are more valued and rewarded than law-abiding citizens.

[00:43:29] It's so overwhelming, so demoralizing.

[00:43:32] You feel like giving up.

[00:43:34] But we can't.

[00:43:35] We shouldn't.

[00:43:36] We must not.

[00:43:37] As Winston Churchill said to Britain in the darkest days of World War II,

[00:43:42] Never give in.

[00:43:43] Never give in.

[00:43:44] Never, never, never.

[00:43:46] Never yield to force.

[00:43:48] Never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.

[00:43:52] And that's what we say to you today.

[00:43:55] This is not a time to give in,

[00:43:57] but to step up and join Point of View in providing clarity in the chaos.

[00:44:02] We can't do it alone, but together, with God's help, we will overcome the darkness.

[00:44:09] Invest in biblical clarity today at pointofview.net or call 1-800-347-5151.

[00:44:18] Pointofview.net and 800-347-5151.

[00:44:27] Point of View will continue after this.