Credit Card Surcharges Rise & Instagram's New Musical Vibes

[00:00:20] [SPEAKER_00]: Incredible edition of Tech Watch Radio. We keep an eye on tech, see you don't have to.

[00:00:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Brought to you by NetworkProvidersInc.com. You've got a friend in the IT business. Wow,

[00:00:30] [SPEAKER_00]: on the last episode we talked about phishing links becoming a bigger threat than email

[00:00:36] [SPEAKER_00]: attachments. Both are a serious issue though, computer week. We talked about I brought up

[00:00:41] [SPEAKER_00]: Iron Scales, the best email security solution on the market. Secure your inboxes, ironscales.com.

[00:00:48] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't get paid from them, I just use them and I really think that their involvement

[00:00:51] [SPEAKER_00]: of training the employees to understand the good, the bad, the do's, the don'ts, the

[00:00:55] [SPEAKER_00]: alt is really a component others haven't spent the time on and I really think there's

[00:01:00] [SPEAKER_00]: serious, serious solutions there in terms of employees can be the greatest benefit

[00:01:07] [SPEAKER_00]: or the worst or least the worst link in the chain so to speak when it comes to security

[00:01:13] [SPEAKER_00]: and so I really think they're wise in doing so. We also discussed the pros and cons of

[00:01:19] [SPEAKER_00]: email versus real time solutions such as Slack or other chat or messenger solutions. I

[00:01:25] [SPEAKER_00]: think that discussion is really good. I like email because I think it's real time

[00:01:28] [SPEAKER_00]: enough, it's archivable, it's downloadable. If you don't want to stick with the same

[00:01:33] [SPEAKER_00]: system you can do something about it and best of all you don't feel that pressure

[00:01:37] [SPEAKER_00]: when it's real time chat and they can look at you and say Sam's been at his computer

[00:01:41] [SPEAKER_00]: for 20 minutes man why the heck isn't he not responding to me? Come on Sam! And this

[00:01:45] [SPEAKER_00]: pressure of instant response all the time and the need to kind of respond, oh I

[00:01:50] [SPEAKER_00]: gotta just respond to this person really quick hold on. And so I've got a call

[00:01:52] [SPEAKER_00]: on hold and someone standing at my desk and all those people are waiting so I can

[00:01:56] [SPEAKER_00]: make the chat first. And then it's a very slow way to communicate for the most part

[00:02:00] [SPEAKER_00]: meaning if I'm gonna write something up I want time to think about what I'm writing.

[00:02:04] [SPEAKER_00]: If I'm gonna write I don't want to be under pressure to just have to write real

[00:02:08] [SPEAKER_00]: time and they're sitting there watching me type going okay Sam come on buddy

[00:02:12] [SPEAKER_00]: okay let's go little fishy. It's like what? Stop! I'm just trying to... Anyway I

[00:02:18] [SPEAKER_00]: digress except for we talked about that last time and I really want people

[00:02:22] [SPEAKER_00]: to kind of think about some of those things you know. Do you want to

[00:02:25] [SPEAKER_00]: just set time where it's like hey I look at my email three times a day I

[00:02:27] [SPEAKER_00]: just don't do it more than that. Unless I need to be the civic that I'm waiting on.

[00:02:31] [SPEAKER_00]: And I agree because people can't multitask and that's the problem with

[00:02:34] [SPEAKER_00]: these chat clients and this slack and some of these things. People are

[00:02:37] [SPEAKER_00]: interrupted all the time. Yep and it lowers productivity. And so I really

[00:02:44] [SPEAKER_00]: believe that email kind of has the sweetest balance between almost real

[00:02:48] [SPEAKER_00]: time but yet not so in-your-face pressure about that and I know email

[00:02:53] [SPEAKER_00]: seems to be old school and everything else but I want people to kind of

[00:02:55] [SPEAKER_00]: rethink about it. And as we get more and more and more technologically

[00:02:59] [SPEAKER_00]: advanced in terms of how to handle the modern day of security and reliability

[00:03:04] [SPEAKER_00]: and all that kind of stuff as we make advances in that email. Email will

[00:03:08] [SPEAKER_00]: continue to be the tool of choice for a lot of reasons for a lot of people so

[00:03:11] [SPEAKER_00]: don't dismiss it too quickly is the point. Alright Jay you're gonna love

[00:03:14] [SPEAKER_00]: this one. Instagram profiles buddy. Yeah they're getting a musical update.

[00:03:22] [SPEAKER_00]: Here's what the note says USA Today about it Jay. Instagram users will be

[00:03:26] [SPEAKER_00]: able to select a song to play on their profile. You can kind of set a vibe for

[00:03:33] [SPEAKER_00]: your page with this. It's kind of reliving the old MySpace days in a way

[00:03:38] [SPEAKER_00]: because that's kind of a feature of what it was back in those days. Yeah but people are

[00:03:42] [SPEAKER_00]: kind of liking that and I guess they're partnering with some rock

[00:03:46] [SPEAKER_00]: stars to get this done and some of them are kind of announcing their

[00:03:49] [SPEAKER_00]: latest singles that way and it's kind of a promo tool for people. It

[00:03:53] [SPEAKER_00]: could just be your vibe or you can use it to kind of lead with something of

[00:03:56] [SPEAKER_00]: whatever and they say how the new music feature in Instagram works. I

[00:04:01] [SPEAKER_00]: guess music added below the or to a profile I guess is below the bio on

[00:04:10] [SPEAKER_00]: the page. It appears as though adding a song like you would view others you

[00:04:16] [SPEAKER_00]: know profile songs or whatever and stuff and they say all you got to do

[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_00]: is navigate to your profile on Instagram, tap edit profile, scroll all the way down

[00:04:27] [SPEAKER_00]: and you should see a music option list. You can tap, you can search for an

[00:04:31] [SPEAKER_00]: artist, find a song. It'll recommend a section of the song that should be

[00:04:34] [SPEAKER_00]: your little clip or you can kind of tap the beginning ending of where you

[00:04:38] [SPEAKER_00]: want the clip to be and it can cut it out and you can kind of save it.

[00:04:41] [SPEAKER_00]: You can go back there and update it and all this kind of stuff and I

[00:04:45] [SPEAKER_00]: kind of find that pretty interesting Jay because again a lot of people for

[00:04:48] [SPEAKER_00]: example if you're a talk show host like I am you know I might just put the

[00:04:52] [SPEAKER_00]: latest TechWatch episode there. If you could change it dynamically

[00:04:56] [SPEAKER_01]: like that you may just have to put sort of your demo reel there or something.

[00:05:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah or I could put just a promo for the show I could do a little commercial

[00:05:03] [SPEAKER_00]: for it, a video or a audio or whatever and just a little clip and say hey man

[00:05:07] [SPEAKER_00]: check out TechWatch radio we keep an eye on sexy you don't have to

[00:05:10] [SPEAKER_00]: brought to you by NetworkProvidersInc.com. You've got a friend of

[00:05:14] [SPEAKER_00]: tech business join us see the latest episode or whatever at NPItechguys.com

[00:05:21] [SPEAKER_00]: or whatever and now I can kind of lead with that and promote with that so

[00:05:25] [SPEAKER_00]: I think it'll be a marketing tool for a lot of small time and other

[00:05:27] [SPEAKER_00]: influencers in many ways not just a fun oh listen to the song I kind of

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_00]: like this week or you know a song that's my theme song or whatever I

[00:05:36] [SPEAKER_00]: think it'll be used for more than that you're already seeing they're

[00:05:38] [SPEAKER_00]: partnering with some stars who are releasing their singles this way and

[00:05:41] [SPEAKER_00]: it's kind of a teaser for hey go get my single elsewhere kind of a thing.

[00:05:45] [SPEAKER_01]: Pretty interesting. Yeah it is interesting I think it it's a little

[00:05:49] [SPEAKER_01]: more gimmicky that first thing was you started reading the article I thought

[00:05:52] [SPEAKER_01]: was MySpace used to do that yeah that's right also I don't see a lot

[00:05:56] [SPEAKER_01]: of influencers getting as much traction we certainly there are

[00:06:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Instagram influencers no doubt but they don't get the kind of traction that

[00:06:03] [SPEAKER_01]: they do in places like YouTube and TikTok and things like that on

[00:06:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Instagram because Instagram is trying to position themselves to be more

[00:06:11] [SPEAKER_01]: of a this is your your secret group of friends or maybe not secret but like

[00:06:17] [SPEAKER_01]: Facebook is for grandma and Instagram is for your close friends almost like

[00:06:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Snapchat or something would be and so you can you can put your bar pictures

[00:06:25] [SPEAKER_01]: in your whatever stupid pictures on there and people will get it I don't

[00:06:29] [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think that Instagram it's not getting the traction for business and

[00:06:33] [SPEAKER_01]: influencers and the kind of commercial traction that I think that they

[00:06:37] [SPEAKER_01]: wanted to see that they saw with Facebook for example but they're not

[00:06:41] [SPEAKER_00]: getting that so much there. Really what they're doing Jay with all these

[00:06:44] [SPEAKER_00]: different services they're finding out which features are kind of like killer

[00:06:49] [SPEAKER_00]: app features which ones will have longevity and which ones won't yeah and

[00:06:52] [SPEAKER_00]: so I think they're kind of bringing back that MySpace to say is that

[00:06:55] [SPEAKER_00]: something people really miss and would like or will that just be

[00:06:57] [SPEAKER_00]: whatever in the future not even important how much will the TikTok I

[00:07:02] [SPEAKER_00]: div short just scroll videos forever I mean they really like to

[00:07:06] [SPEAKER_00]: focus on how addictive these apps are and stuff and they just love to keep

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_00]: you on and keep you scrolling and just waste tons of time and a lot of the

[00:07:13] [SPEAKER_00]: features that they want to build in for their own reasons or features that I

[00:07:15] [SPEAKER_01]: don't really enjoy very much. Yeah I would agree and then they're not even

[00:07:20] [SPEAKER_01]: things that I mean I barely use Instagram I have an account but it's

[00:07:25] [SPEAKER_01]: just not I barely use Facebook let me put it this way and I'd in the

[00:07:29] [SPEAKER_00]: Instagram even less like a lot less so earlier this month I guess that the

[00:07:36] [SPEAKER_00]: gram also rolled out the ability to have what are called longer carousels

[00:07:40] [SPEAKER_00]: previously you were limited to 10 photos or videos or whatever you want to

[00:07:45] [SPEAKER_00]: say and now users can have up to 20 I guess Jay. You're getting your top friend

[00:07:50] [SPEAKER_00]: spaces right? They call it pieces of content now yeah it's weird and it's almost a

[00:07:57] [SPEAKER_00]: blast from the past but it tells me though that they realized that that's

[00:08:00] [SPEAKER_00]: something they've kind of lost in the you know when you build a better

[00:08:02] [SPEAKER_00]: mousetrap or you build something new it's like oh man we got all these

[00:08:04] [SPEAKER_00]: awesome features but you drop things that people may want and and I still

[00:08:07] [SPEAKER_00]: think we're in the early stages of the social media world I know it

[00:08:10] [SPEAKER_00]: seems like no Sam come on we've already left you know MySpace is and Facebook and

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_00]: AOL and now we're on Tik Tok and X and you know I think that we're gonna we

[00:08:21] [SPEAKER_00]: you ain't seen nothing yet in terms of the evolution of these social media

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_00]: companies in terms of what they can do and everything else I think the big

[00:08:27] [SPEAKER_00]: next I don't know what you want to call it but the next play will be we're

[00:08:30] [SPEAKER_00]: gonna build payment capabilities into our system you're gonna embrace our

[00:08:34] [SPEAKER_00]: ecosystems and then they're gonna find ways where you can earn and spend money

[00:08:40] [SPEAKER_00]: there because that's at the heart of every real ecosystem at the end of the

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_01]: day right yeah and then they got to find ways to tax it too you can't

[00:08:46] [SPEAKER_01]: just be sending money back and forth without you know getting the cut well

[00:08:51] [SPEAKER_00]: and I really think that brings up the next story for this J2 because is

[00:08:58] [SPEAKER_00]: the golden age of credit cards starting to crumble and I hope so

[00:09:03] [SPEAKER_00]: because credit cards you know I know in the beginning it was like a it's a

[00:09:07] [SPEAKER_00]: convenience thing but then it's become man everybody uses it so much credit card

[00:09:12] [SPEAKER_00]: debit card virtually same thing when I know they're different in their

[00:09:16] [SPEAKER_00]: details but when it comes to charging a card they're virtually the same

[00:09:19] [SPEAKER_00]: thing but it's gotten to where the credit card companies are so greedy

[00:09:22] [SPEAKER_00]: they want so much of the pie to where now companies are pushing back

[00:09:25] [SPEAKER_00]: and they're like yeah if you want to pay cash it's this much otherwise

[00:09:28] [SPEAKER_00]: we'll just add a 3% or 4% or 5% whatever we're gonna add to it for

[00:09:31] [SPEAKER_00]: the credit card charge and now it's kind of backfired and people are starting to

[00:09:35] [SPEAKER_01]: hate it Jay it is and people are starting to move away from it we're

[00:09:38] [SPEAKER_01]: seeing more and more businesses I saw an email from kinetic this week and it

[00:09:44] [SPEAKER_01]: said you know starting soon kinetics going to begin adding a credit

[00:09:47] [SPEAKER_01]: surcharge of no more than 3% on all credit card transactions the surcharge

[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_01]: is gonna apply to all credit card transactions whether single use or

[00:09:54] [SPEAKER_01]: reoccurring payments if this is the offset increasing costs associated with

[00:09:58] [SPEAKER_01]: processing payments directly with credit card providers you know so

[00:10:01] [SPEAKER_01]: they're passing on their merchant fees to the customer and a lot of

[00:10:05] [SPEAKER_01]: businesses are starting to do this used to see a cash discount maybe if you did

[00:10:10] [SPEAKER_01]: that but now they're being very transparent about hey the prices are

[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_01]: the same we're not necessarily giving you a discount because you're paying

[00:10:16] [SPEAKER_01]: cash but we are gonna change that merchant fee that three four percent

[00:10:21] [SPEAKER_01]: whatever that we're paying for the convenience of credit card and we're

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_01]: gonna put it on the first place I ever saw this and this has been for

[00:10:28] [SPEAKER_01]: happening was like the DMV and government places because they're like

[00:10:31] [SPEAKER_01]: hey we have this certain amount of money that we have to collect for the

[00:10:35] [SPEAKER_01]: fees for your tag or whatever and just because we're making it convenient for

[00:10:40] [SPEAKER_01]: you to use a credit card we're not gonna eat those fees and businesses on

[00:10:43] [SPEAKER_01]: the other hand have just been like well we just want the business and

[00:10:45] [SPEAKER_01]: we don't care we're gonna make it convenient we're just absorb that

[00:10:47] [SPEAKER_01]: cost but a lot of businesses as you're getting down to slimmer and

[00:10:51] [SPEAKER_01]: slimmer margins there they just can't deal with 3% 3% can make or

[00:10:56] [SPEAKER_01]: something and so they're saying hey if you want to use a credit card you got

[00:10:59] [SPEAKER_01]: to you got to pay the freight for it because we're not gonna do it and so

[00:11:03] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm seeing a lot of companies recently that are moving away from just

[00:11:09] [SPEAKER_01]: absorbing that fee yeah I don't know how this is gonna impact Visa and

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_01]: MasterCard if this shift starts to happen even more I mean are we gonna

[00:11:18] [SPEAKER_01]: see resurgence of cash I mean we saw things like cash app which had a

[00:11:22] [SPEAKER_01]: really great business model of hey if you're just exchanging cash between

[00:11:26] [SPEAKER_01]: friends there's no fees there's no like it's as good as cash but then the IRS

[00:11:32] [SPEAKER_01]: you know started to say whoa we got to get our hands in there is kind of

[00:11:35] [SPEAKER_01]: loose what I was saying earlier when you see even with micro transactions

[00:11:38] [SPEAKER_01]: they're not gonna say well we got to make that you know whatever that tax

[00:11:42] [SPEAKER_01]: percent on all of those micro transactions and so cash app kind of

[00:11:46] [SPEAKER_01]: you know they started saying oh anything if you do more than $600

[00:11:50] [SPEAKER_01]: worth of transactions even with your friends even if you're just paying for

[00:11:54] [SPEAKER_01]: rent now they did they did walk that back some and they said well if it's

[00:11:57] [SPEAKER_01]: reimbursements and you specifically say in that transaction that it's a

[00:12:01] [SPEAKER_01]: reimbursement because I'm splitting a dinner with somebody or I've given them

[00:12:04] [SPEAKER_01]: money for rent or whatever but they need to make a vehicle like cash app

[00:12:09] [SPEAKER_01]: where you can really exchange cash without all that intervention sort of

[00:12:13] [SPEAKER_01]: thing I think and or people are just gonna go back to cash I mean that's

[00:12:15] [SPEAKER_00]: gonna be their only result I'm not gonna go back to cash because they're

[00:12:18] [SPEAKER_00]: gonna make it impossible to what they're gonna do is they're gonna tempt you with

[00:12:21] [SPEAKER_00]: all these new social media services or cryptocurrency or some of these you know

[00:12:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Venmo or cash apps or different things and they'll have way less fees if they

[00:12:30] [SPEAKER_00]: go directly from your bank accounts or directly from your whatever's and not

[00:12:34] [SPEAKER_00]: use credit cards and tell everybody moves to that and then those fees

[00:12:37] [SPEAKER_00]: will start to ratchet up and you've already seen that in PayPal and Venmo

[00:12:41] [SPEAKER_00]: and everything else they've slowly but surely and we reported on this a

[00:12:43] [SPEAKER_00]: couple weeks ago how they're changing and and starting to charge more yeah

[00:12:47] [SPEAKER_00]: it's unfortunate but I'm telling you they're gonna move us there and do that so credit

[00:12:50] [SPEAKER_00]: cards are on the out for sure but payment systems that have a man in the

[00:12:54] [SPEAKER_00]: middle that charges chunk of change ain't going away anytime soon in fact

[00:12:57] [SPEAKER_00]: it's gonna be more where you can't prevent it they're gonna they're gonna

[00:13:00] [SPEAKER_00]: make it right now I can go to a different card and get a lower fee or

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_00]: I can you know take cash or I can do this that they're gonna get to

[00:13:06] [SPEAKER_00]: where you won't have alternatives Jay everybody will be doing the same

[00:13:09] [SPEAKER_00]: thing and that number will just ratchet up and if you don't like it

[00:13:12] [SPEAKER_00]: then you can't have a bank account or you can't this or you can't that

[00:13:15] [SPEAKER_01]: I sadly think that's where we're headed I I do too and I but I want to see

[00:13:21] [SPEAKER_01]: people use more cash I mean I think it's the only last bastion that we have

[00:13:25] [SPEAKER_01]: left of kind of mind your own business and be able to barter and you know do

[00:13:31] [SPEAKER_01]: things around in but I don't know how you make an electronic equivalent

[00:13:35] [SPEAKER_01]: of that maybe that's cryptocurrency I don't know but there you know that

[00:13:37] [SPEAKER_01]: gets even sticky and difficult but credit cards are having problems I

[00:13:41] [SPEAKER_01]: mean another story just this week came out American Express no longer

[00:13:44] [SPEAKER_01]: accepted on eBay if you want to transact in eBay they will not directly accept

[00:13:50] [SPEAKER_01]: American Express anymore I don't know what the beef is with them between

[00:13:53] [SPEAKER_01]: Amex and eBay but there is a workaround a little bit if you want to add your

[00:13:58] [SPEAKER_01]: you could say add your American Express card your PayPal or Venmo

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_01]: accounts and pay that way but you know I just see that people are kind of

[00:14:06] [SPEAKER_01]: getting their feathers ruffled a little bit with these banks I think if

[00:14:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Visa MasterCard really want to number one they're making this

[00:14:12] [SPEAKER_01]: percentage off of every single transaction in the world it seems like

[00:14:16] [SPEAKER_01]: you could lower those down to just fractions of a percent and still make

[00:14:22] [SPEAKER_01]: billions by the handful and not have the so much of the burden I mean you

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_01]: want it to be almost transparent to the people with it where the the

[00:14:30] [SPEAKER_01]: fractional percent that's coming out isn't like if like a 3% on your

[00:14:34] [SPEAKER_01]: bottom line it's just some tiny little and no one bemoans real

[00:14:38] [SPEAKER_00]: out here no one has a problem with knowing that they're providing a

[00:14:40] [SPEAKER_00]: service and right they need to be paid for that service nobody has a problem

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_00]: for that convenience factor but when it becomes too abusive and the

[00:14:47] [SPEAKER_00]: transactions become bigger and bigger and bigger towards like if I charge a

[00:14:51] [SPEAKER_00]: credit card for a thousand bucks those guys are getting 30 35 whatever

[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_00]: dollars yeah on that transaction man that starts to eat again your

[00:15:01] [SPEAKER_00]: profits and more and more companies you only make in my 20 bucks on that

[00:15:04] [SPEAKER_01]: you there goes all of your profit and you're in the negative now

[00:15:06] [SPEAKER_00]: because of that right and most of the time people aren't just making

[00:15:09] [SPEAKER_00]: that much and they're not taking all the profit but they're taking enough to

[00:15:12] [SPEAKER_00]: where it's significant let's just take restaurants are a great example

[00:15:15] [SPEAKER_00]: restaurants and gas stations are where I first saw them kind of say if you pay

[00:15:18] [SPEAKER_00]: with cash it's cheaper yeah and now it's going to everybody everywhere I

[00:15:24] [SPEAKER_00]: don't do that with my business and my consulting because I just feel like

[00:15:27] [SPEAKER_00]: you know but you know they say send a check-in who's got checks Jay

[00:15:31] [SPEAKER_00]: somebody asked me for a check the other day and I'm like I got a hold of my

[00:15:35] [SPEAKER_00]: wife I'm like honey do we have checks I still have just like she's

[00:15:40] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know let me look at we had a checkbook that had like two checks left

[00:15:43] [SPEAKER_00]: in it or something and she's like yeah I think we can write a check but I'm

[00:15:46] [SPEAKER_00]: just like who does that nowadays I mean come on so I still have checks I

[00:15:50] [SPEAKER_01]: don't carry them with me or anything you know sometimes I might have them in

[00:15:53] [SPEAKER_01]: the car but you know I've written like probably four checks last year

[00:15:58] [SPEAKER_01]: like that's how small it is and usually it's the government or you know

[00:16:02] [SPEAKER_01]: things that you've got to do or maybe an extra payment to a mortgage

[00:16:05] [SPEAKER_01]: company or something like that but yeah nobody writes checks anymore but

[00:16:09] [SPEAKER_01]: going back to the credit card thing it's an important distinction though of I

[00:16:12] [SPEAKER_01]: think of where merchants and in businesses are saying instead of saying

[00:16:17] [SPEAKER_01]: this is a cash discount they're saying that these are the prices and we're

[00:16:21] [SPEAKER_01]: gonna if you're gonna pay with a credit card for your convenience then

[00:16:26] [SPEAKER_01]: we're going to add on that merchant fee back to you you know I think

[00:16:29] [SPEAKER_01]: that's important and because otherwise people get the idea that well I'm

[00:16:33] [SPEAKER_01]: getting a better deal cuz I'm getting cash because well maybe these

[00:16:35] [SPEAKER_01]: guys aren't reporting it or maybe they're just doing it under the table

[00:16:38] [SPEAKER_01]: it's not like that the businesses are saying there's a there's an expense to

[00:16:41] [SPEAKER_01]: this and it's big and for some people it's tens of thousands of dollars a

[00:16:46] [SPEAKER_01]: month that they're sending to just Visa and MasterCard for no reason and

[00:16:50] [SPEAKER_01]: it's going out of the local economy and it's taking people off well and I

[00:16:54] [SPEAKER_00]: think that it's a good move for businesses to do this not because I

[00:16:57] [SPEAKER_00]: like being forced to pay that extra fee but because what it does is it

[00:17:01] [SPEAKER_00]: makes that fee transparent and I think what the credit card companies in the

[00:17:04] [SPEAKER_00]: past have defended on is no one really knows about that fee no one's

[00:17:07] [SPEAKER_00]: focused on that fee who cares oh yeah let's get that fee big but when you

[00:17:11] [SPEAKER_00]: transfer that to the customer and the customers like are you kidding me I got

[00:17:13] [SPEAKER_00]: to pay three more percent for this I mean they're not gonna buy it I'm

[00:17:18] [SPEAKER_00]: gonna go to the bank teller and get cash or I'm gonna eat it this time

[00:17:20] [SPEAKER_00]: it be ticked off the more that happens I think the more consumers and

[00:17:25] [SPEAKER_00]: businesses can demand look you've got to decrease these fees at some

[00:17:29] [SPEAKER_00]: point and I'm not trying to get political here but at some point I

[00:17:31] [SPEAKER_00]: imagine this will hit legislative bodies and groups around the country

[00:17:36] [SPEAKER_00]: or you know the Securities and Exchange Commission or something to where it's

[00:17:40] [SPEAKER_00]: like at what point is it a monopoly with these credit card companies we get

[00:17:44] [SPEAKER_00]: we don't know their formula to determine how good or bad your credit

[00:17:47] [SPEAKER_00]: is we don't have any ability to can nobody can stop or control these

[00:17:51] [SPEAKER_00]: fees really if you're a bigger company you can make those fees less

[00:17:54] [SPEAKER_00]: than if you're a smaller company and you could say well that's just a

[00:17:57] [SPEAKER_00]: risk-reward analysis I know but not when you're for this is the only way

[00:18:01] [SPEAKER_00]: that you can do transaction these days so it's not just like I don't have to

[00:18:08] [SPEAKER_00]: use this more and more you do have to use this right you can't even do

[00:18:10] [SPEAKER_00]: business yeah because it takes it into more of a utility like you know gas

[00:18:17] [SPEAKER_00]: and power and whatever you want to say then it like water sewer more of a

[00:18:21] [SPEAKER_00]: utility and more of a necessity than just a nicety or whatever we're beyond

[00:18:26] [SPEAKER_00]: that point in this and so the reason I bring that up is I'm telling you

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_00]: that at some point it is gonna reach critical mass and there will be a push

[00:18:32] [SPEAKER_00]: back and I look at this compared to the real estate industry I don't know if you

[00:18:35] [SPEAKER_00]: know but just about a week and a half ago yeah or two weeks ago in the

[00:18:38] [SPEAKER_00]: real estate industry they just changed how contracts works because they're

[00:18:40] [SPEAKER_00]: like hey buyers and sellers agents are getting six percent of a deal and now

[00:18:46] [SPEAKER_00]: that houses are so expensive hey man if you have a five hundred thousand

[00:18:49] [SPEAKER_00]: dollar house you know and you could say well I don't have one of the

[00:18:53] [SPEAKER_00]: well you might have bought your house for way less but you know

[00:18:55] [SPEAKER_00]: houses are out of control now almost everybody's got a half million dollar

[00:18:58] [SPEAKER_00]: house or whatever now quarter million at least right and you go on that

[00:19:04] [SPEAKER_00]: five hundred thousand dollar house how much is six percent thirty thousand

[00:19:08] [SPEAKER_00]: dollars right thirty thousand dollars people okay that's a nice commission a

[00:19:14] [SPEAKER_00]: house if you sell a house three or four or five times in say a ten year

[00:19:18] [SPEAKER_00]: period of time or whatever I mean you're talking about boo-goo money you

[00:19:22] [SPEAKER_00]: know and so people are gonna be pushing back and I'm predicting that

[00:19:25] [SPEAKER_00]: there will be a pushback I'm also predicting that what they'll do is

[00:19:28] [SPEAKER_00]: move us to these systems and make us believe it's getting better where did my

[00:19:32] [SPEAKER_00]: pattern for that well history repeats itself Jay my pattern for that is

[00:19:36] [SPEAKER_00]: everybody wanted a cord cut everybody wanted to say I don't want to buy this

[00:19:39] [SPEAKER_00]: bundle of 300 channels or whatever right so they all cord cut and it was

[00:19:44] [SPEAKER_00]: cheaper at first but now everybody has to have three or four or five or

[00:19:47] [SPEAKER_00]: six or seven channels and every channel is more expensive because it

[00:19:50] [SPEAKER_00]: has to stand alone right yep so by the time I do that I'm right back

[00:19:53] [SPEAKER_00]: where my cable bill was it's just a whole lot more nuanced to pay to

[00:19:56] [SPEAKER_00]: their ear to manage and deal with and and then I want to cancel this service

[00:20:00] [SPEAKER_00]: but wait I like that I watch this or I do this on this and I got to have that

[00:20:04] [SPEAKER_00]: because of this and we're right back where we started Jay well we're almost

[00:20:08] [SPEAKER_01]: worse off well I don't know I debate that because I think that people like

[00:20:12] [SPEAKER_01]: the transparency whether even if they're not as well off so to speak

[00:20:16] [SPEAKER_01]: you know maybe they got a better deal with a big bundle of 300 channels I

[00:20:20] [SPEAKER_01]: think people like the transparency and they like not paying for you know

[00:20:24] [SPEAKER_01]: that they don't approve of or stuff that maybe you know against their own

[00:20:28] [SPEAKER_01]: morals and things I mean people I remember groups saying well we don't want

[00:20:32] [SPEAKER_01]: to pay for MTV or whatever you know in the in these giant bundles and

[00:20:37] [SPEAKER_01]: other channels that we disagree with so I think the transparency is key in

[00:20:40] [SPEAKER_01]: all of these issues whether it's TV bundling or whether it's credit card

[00:20:45] [SPEAKER_01]: when the when the customer can see and the consumer if things aren't

[00:20:50] [SPEAKER_01]: hidden and bundled and behind the scenes that's that sunshine that light into the

[00:20:54] [SPEAKER_01]: to what's really going on is what can make change happen if customers become

[00:20:59] [SPEAKER_01]: aware of this and these merchant fees which really unless you had a business

[00:21:02] [SPEAKER_01]: you have no clue I mean you just don't even know realize or care what's

[00:21:06] [SPEAKER_01]: going on behind the scenes there now you might when it starts to impact

[00:21:09] [SPEAKER_01]: your bottom line when you see prices are higher because of this and that

[00:21:12] [SPEAKER_01]: can put some pressure hopefully not from government industries but maybe

[00:21:16] [SPEAKER_01]: internally with the companies themselves to say you know what guys

[00:21:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, their customers the customers always right to some degree right?

[00:21:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah in matters of taste.

[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_01]: That kind of mentality.

[00:21:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah so but I bring that up and the problem that I have is it's not like

[00:21:28] [SPEAKER_00]: you're buying channels all a cart like we had proposed what they've really done

[00:21:31] [SPEAKER_00]: is they've just created instead of me having one or two bundles from

[00:21:34] [SPEAKER_00]: satellite or from cable TV and three or four bundles within each of those

[00:21:38] [SPEAKER_00]: services so I might have had five or six bundles I could choose from now

[00:21:41] [SPEAKER_00]: I've got 50 bundles.

[00:21:42] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah the only difference they're just smaller and more expensive but it's

[00:21:46] [SPEAKER_00]: like I'm buying my channels all a cart you know I'm buying all of this or all of

[00:21:51] [SPEAKER_00]: that and like Amazon Prime you know I'm paying for that and they've taken more

[00:21:57] [SPEAKER_00]: and more and more out of that and then what they've done is they've came back

[00:21:59] [SPEAKER_00]: and said not only do you have a paid service but now we're gonna add

[00:22:02] [SPEAKER_00]: commercials and now it's paid with commercials but man you can get the

[00:22:05] [SPEAKER_00]: plush or the premium one and get rid of the commercials if you want to

[00:22:07] [SPEAKER_00]: then pretty soon they'll be like premium won't get it you got to have

[00:22:10] [SPEAKER_00]: super premium and then we can get rid of the commercials for you you only

[00:22:13] [SPEAKER_00]: have half the commercials because you're only on the middle planner all

[00:22:15] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm saying is I just see really things kind of worsening Jay in a lot of ways

[00:22:19] [SPEAKER_01]: do you think it's better or worse from the direct TV days versus the

[00:22:23] [SPEAKER_00]: streaming days overall I think it's better for me I don't buy a lot of the

[00:22:27] [SPEAKER_00]: services comparatively I think it's overall better but if we're not very

[00:22:30] [SPEAKER_00]: careful and if we the people aren't very vigilant as customers and if we

[00:22:33] [SPEAKER_00]: don't you know speak up or whatever it's gonna get worse because it's

[00:22:36] [SPEAKER_00]: gonna be 50 bundles instead of six it's and those bundles are gonna

[00:22:39] [SPEAKER_00]: have commercials along with them too so you're gonna pay and have

[00:22:41] [SPEAKER_00]: commercials where you know I mean I guess we got that way with cable but you

[00:22:46] [SPEAKER_00]: know TV used to be free it's not only you know now we have both you do still

[00:22:52] [SPEAKER_01]: have treated air TV which is better because of digital there's a lot more

[00:22:55] [SPEAKER_01]: channels available and things like that but I think it's better anyway

[00:22:58] [SPEAKER_01]: because not only I mean forget about the inflation rate between the two

[00:23:02] [SPEAKER_01]: but say in the 2000s you might have been paying 85 bucks for the

[00:23:05] [SPEAKER_01]: satellite next or a dish network or direct TV or something like that or

[00:23:10] [SPEAKER_01]: cable and now you know you might be paying yeah you're paying for three or

[00:23:14] [SPEAKER_01]: four different services but you might be paying 30 40 bucks maybe but you're

[00:23:19] [SPEAKER_01]: getting just the stuff that you want and then you put an inflation there

[00:23:23] [SPEAKER_01]: it's probably half that compared to the difference you're doing pretty

[00:23:26] [SPEAKER_00]: well I think if you want full bore TV via digital style versus old-school

[00:23:32] [SPEAKER_00]: cable style I mean if you buy YouTube TV for example and you want

[00:23:37] [SPEAKER_00]: some of the sports networks and some of the different premium features

[00:23:43] [SPEAKER_01]: you know the difference is you know if you're if that's all you do you know it

[00:23:51] [SPEAKER_01]: might be worth it but I remember people have been with cable and satellite and

[00:23:55] [SPEAKER_01]: stuff having TV bills of $175 and I'm just like what are you thinking yeah

[00:24:01] [SPEAKER_00]: that's for sure I also find this this is a plus that I want to point out

[00:24:05] [SPEAKER_00]: too in this change you know it used to be door if you had cable at your

[00:24:08] [SPEAKER_00]: house Jay and you and I were family that doesn't mean I have cable at my

[00:24:12] [SPEAKER_00]: house well a lot of these services now have screens and you're paying for the

[00:24:17] [SPEAKER_00]: number of screens they don't mind if you jointly team up as kind of yeah

[00:24:20] [SPEAKER_00]: they're starting to cut them down on that too they're starting to get down

[00:24:23] [SPEAKER_00]: on that but again my response is why don't you do it by screens though

[00:24:26] [SPEAKER_00]: you do that you make people really happy and you can get a lot anyway

[00:24:29] [SPEAKER_00]: there's a lot to that they can benefit both sides true there's a lot

[00:24:33] [SPEAKER_00]: of great things anyway enough of it but I'm telling you right now things

[00:24:36] [SPEAKER_00]: are changing and I say at the heart of it will be social media and every one

[00:24:40] [SPEAKER_00]: of them is going to create a way to do payments and get you into their

[00:24:43] [SPEAKER_00]: ecosystem you've got a friend in the IT business network providers inc.com